Special Interest

Context:
http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/crossfade/2013/12/wolf_eyes_interview_basel_miami_2013.php (http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/crossfade/2013/12/wolf_eyes_interview_basel_miami_2013.php)

I know, I know, I know...
And sorry for the sarcasm.

the king is dead, long live the king.

uff the new git-player wasnt too impressive in those youtubes. the  rockout stuff of the second clip was good stuff though

It seems many ''noise'' people from 2000-2010 are turning to Rock or Techno. It is not uncommon when an artist quits the scene that made him that he proclaims it ''dead''. Does he quit because it's dead or is it dead because he quits hehe ??!

On a related note, I was reading a Daft Punk interview recently, and basically they were saying "Techno is dead, we're doing original disco-funk, we have re-discovered REAL MUSIC"

In France they say it's "cracher dans la soupe" (bite the hand that fed you ?)

Who care what he think...

Traded a few things with Mr Olsen/American Tapes back in the 90s and enjoyed the sounds he sent.

Remained largely blissfully unaware of the brief mainstream noise explosion of the mid-00s when that amusing mothersagainstnoise website appeared and kids a lot younger than me popped up on myspace with excessive enthusiasm and a skewed sense of history. As ever, some lasted, some faded away. Sorry I missed the recent Wolf Eyes show not far from me, heard it was good and would have been nice to finally meet face to face.

How could i not make this?

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1441222_10152093187428659_1600395456_n.jpg)

He does have a point in the last answer about "a million people playing to themselves trying to be geniuses", though.

The part that struck me as odd was this:

Quote
Matt Preira: And at the same time you're playing trip metal, a great majority of what once constituted the noise scene has started playing one form or another of electronic dance music.
John Olson: A lot of these cats digging into the techno trend don't seem to be too-well versed in the history of dance music and that culture. So what they're coming out with is on the wrong side of naive and amateur. It seems like a lame attempt to get more people to gigs. socialize the music instead of keeping it alien and abstract.

Is it really "a great majority" of noise artists who are making electronic dance music now?  That sounds like hyperbole to me, but it's not like I really know a lot about that scene.

John is one of them, though.  http://americantapes.us/hazel.html

Bullshit-statement from a bullshit-band...

Prurient is more beat-friendly (wih his Vatican Shadow)....but that's about it? if Wolf Eyes lived more outside their artfart-free-rock-cave they should know

yes, i don't like Wolf Eyes, i tried, ow god i tried but it usually ends in neverending no-skill experimentalism (= jamming) that just says nothing. (maybe The Driller wasn't that bad)

Is noise over?
Completely, 100 percent. That's part of why I'm quitting the label. All the categories, everything has run its course.

That's obviously silly.  I think what he was saying, and this is what most people are saying when they declare a style of music is dead, is "X is over for me."  That's a completely natural outcome to anything in life when the rewards and benefits cease.  When you stop getting something out of anything, it is dead to you.

The whole solo culture of it has invented a million people playing by themselves trying to be geniuses. You're getting a million one-way conversations.

Now, this is the meat of his comment.  I'd bet he read or heard that somewhere else, but the source is irrelevant.  That's worth discussion and opinion.

Noise has certainly changed. And what people tell from USA, I guess quite a lot. If you considered the whole "No Fun Fest" kind, 4 month house-to-house gig network and dozens of labels rushing out batches of tapes being living noise, I guess current state could be described "dead".
If someone would ask me how many Wolf Eyes/Hair Police/Giffoni/Dilloway/etc etc.. releases I have sold over the last 2-3 years, I could say pretty close to exact zero. And not that these makers would be bad. Especially Dilloway is genius, I dare to say. But a lot of things have natural timespan and will fade down unless they're able to inject new lifeforce into scene.

Their highlight days probably long gone, but I see a lot more interesting new noise coming and being popular. (add " " )

Dying noise depends on age of listeners. Elder see it as a dying genre but those younger see it as a new, vital phenomena. The same again and again, since 30 years. Nothing has been changed.

Quote from: FreakAnimalFinland on December 07, 2013, 10:05:04 AM
If someone would ask me how many Wolf Eyes/Hair Police/Giffoni/Dilloway/etc etc.. releases I have sold over the last 2-3 years, I could say pretty close to exact zero.

That's interesting... What do you think "sells" nowadays, or at least on your experience with it? Do our "noise age" have any face, shared qualities...?

Of course as dealer, your vision gets distorted by material you focus on, and your location.

For me most best selling stuff is from Finland, Sweden, Denmark.
Styles most often tape noise, rough edged physical noise. Raw power electronics.

If some years ago, one could move as much Japanese noise as one could stock, now it's entirely different thing. Stocking new release of major japanese artist is less likely sell than debut tape of new project.
At some point german heavy electronics would sell everything. Immediately. Or the Cold Meat kind of stuff. At some point the new wave of USA was hot and discussed by both lovers & haters.
Few years ago the Ramleh, Whitehouse, SJ and CE kind of power electronics appeared to be on utmost rising popularity. Then few years later Cargo is throwing out remains of WH vinyl at almost manufacturing price just to get rid of them and some of the names don't appear to be able to sell out relatively small editions.

But as said, I'm quite sure that what sells good for me, doesn't sell at all from many international distributors. However, I think there is small indication of "popularity", if some bands can move album on tape/LP/CD of hundreds of copies, and others don't think the batch consisting bunch of ltd 15 copies tapes doesn't have enough demand.

So for some artists, noise appears "dead", as most people felt the momentum has passed. And they'll probably fade out, just to wait for next peak in interest and nostalgia fueled reissue offers. Some people don't care of this. They'll keep going regardless. And it's possible that because of this quality, they remain somewhat fresh. No need to have some sort of trend of zeitgeist that is favorable for them and their style.

coming from an entry-level band, that's not saying much. besides they're probably just saying this because they lost their equipment in a house fire. sour grapes.

As a base root, I always look at harsh noise as the ageless almighty; constantly reminded by Roemer's classic quote:

"...NOISE is as old as millions of years of volcanic eruption and mountain erosion. The modern industry of metal and machines added more to this mix. All we do is use everything at our disposal to record the true power that had been filling the airwaves since the beginning of time."

It's something like sharks - they were here before us and will surely be here after us. 

Noise can't die because IT'S FUCKING NOISE!!!
It only takes one brain cell to know this.
Any fucking idiot can do it...don't lie to yourselves like you're so cool - it's an idiot's game played by idiots.
And don't give me that "good noise vs. bad noise" crap, because it's in the eye of the beholder, and most eyes are shit!

Wire magazine said this a few years ago, it's like a current fashion statement.
Wolf Eyes are one band/act amongst many, and not the first in the scene, so why is their view so important, things carry on and develop as with any scene. Maybe folks will play to 10 people like the old days, who cares.

From my point of view, the only relevant thing to ever come from Wolf Eyes is Aaron Dilloway. He is way more vital outside of the band than in. As for their supposed exit from noise, good riddance! May bro rock nirvana await them...

(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e50/tinnitustimulus/Screenshot3_zps858f2c0e.png)
from David Novak's Japanoise

noise will be alive until there will be ears and even beyond.
you cannot stop nature.

the interest for noise may die of course, but this happens to many things in life.

A few years back wolf eyes were on the bill of EVERY major euro festival and large tours, being flown around the world and the full rockstar treatment. Now thats all gone!!! Maybe with declining sales, low bookings and having to go grovelling back to the day jobs is easy to see that the party is now over...I remember one show where merch stall had shitty spray cdr's for 30-50£££!!!!!!

To be honest i have always hated the term "noise", i have mentally viewed the music i enjoy as a form of Industrial culture. When i think of "noise" i see a teenager with a rainbow t-shirt punching the air playing a chaos pad and 2 shitty pedals out of his moms battered old suitcase, meanwhile his three mates push each other about and empty room!!!

if that is on the decline ..then good. Im glad!!!

But after seeing truly mind-blowing performances like Jaakko Vanhala is Dresden or Vomir on a incredible system in Birmingham a few years back and Hal Hutchinson at the Unrest festival, its easy to be clear in ones mind that there are artists out there that will always push way beyond the noise herd.

tinnitustimulus thanks for posting that very apt quote and saving me the bother of looking it up myself.

I think I'm the only person in noise who isn't always moaning about about how bored of harsh noise they are, or on about how they make noise but never listen to other peoples', or how some other (usually hypothetical) group/type of people who make pretty much the exact same kind of sounds as me are doing it so terribly 'wrong' because of the contents of their record collection. :D

Murderous Vision and IFOTS said it best. Wolf Eyes are welcome to fuck off and take the rest of their hippiefied US dude noise with them. The US is in a much healthier state with the newer generation of bands like Vomit Arsonist, Nyodene D and several others. Long may it continue and long may the previous abortion be forgotten.

Quote from: ironfistofthesun on December 09, 2013, 02:37:56 PM
To be honest i have always hated the term "noise", i have mentally viewed the music i enjoy as a form of Industrial culture.

The same thoughts.
I guess that people, for whom "noise" is only the next sound to express their useless, anonymous frustration, will never do and feel this kind of way in life. Then some people see NOISE as fashion which took place somewhere in 90s. NOISE as the next phenomena in pop culture... fucking shit
Anyway I love many WOLF EYES releases... Maybe they are assholes, but they make good music often. They aren't only example that somebody talks stupid things but his art is upon his ordinary life.

Hard to say.  Various musics do essentially decline in popularity and, more importantly, often times little to nothing new is being said.  Even though there are still practitioners today, bebop jazz pretty much died after 1970, avant garde "free" jazz in the '80's, pscyh rock in the '60's, and so on. 

I'm not entirely sure I understand the "one way conversation" quote.  Is he suggesting that the noise performers aren't listening to one another (assuming there are more than one performer... an assumption that may be wrong!) or that the audience isn't emoting to the performance?  And does trip metal somehow solve whatever dilemma he's referring to?

I guess any music is alive as long as there are people around to listen to it. I just happen to believe that noise is the culmination of more than one musical roads (not just rock to metal to industrial) that it's hard to imagine it stagnating. Granted, I'm still in "catch up mode" as a relative newbie.

Quote from: THE RITA HN on December 08, 2013, 02:08:30 AM
As a base root, I always look at harsh noise as the ageless almighty; constantly reminded by Roemer's classic quote:

yeah this. harsh noise at its best hits at something 'beyond' music.

As Long People have the Time to Discuss about it and the Money to make/buy it, i see no "dead" in it.

Its same like Metal, Punk, Oi Ska, Whatever Scene, the Biggest Asses crying about dead dead dead, cause the Money flow isn't anymore. And after some Time, when it begins again to flow, these Asses jumpes out of the Corner to fish more Money. Look at the already really "dead" Metal Scene or the Punk Scene nearly 10 Years ago. $$ i would say

Quote from: SILVUM on December 10, 2013, 12:24:49 AM
Shitting on your past passions is just a reveal of phony intent.

But yeah, heavy fucking sounds will always rule.

Words to live by.

Industrial is infinite, noise is infinite.

I was at University and flicked through the Wire magazine in the library which is has been vocal about noise being 'dead' and for a while they have been pushing a Noise with Beats agenda. But I noticed Wire has become less available in recent years, it's harder to find and you have to go to WH Smiths to look at it. A while ago they would have features on Ramleh, Maja Ratkje, Whitehouse, Prurient and others. It seems that in the latest issue they are trying to claw back their lost credibility with a Birds of Delay article whilst in another review a writer slags of Pruriets alleged 'Goth posturing'. They started the noise is dead ball rolling in one of their end of year reviews a few years back. So glad there's other magazines now as it's become pointless.

The whole 'Noise is Dead' mentality is so dumb, as long as people make stuff, people buy stuff and sounds evolve and develop, it isn't dead. Some of the stuff I reviewed for Heathen Harvest was far from dead. Wolf Eyes are good and all, I saw them once and a few solo shows by members but they are one band among many and not the first in their genre either, good luck in pastures new.

Why did Troniks forum shut down?

Quote from: Lazrs3 on December 12, 2013, 07:12:52 PM


Why did Troniks forum shut down?

Greh humored to put it back up for a day, but I think his intentions were as serious as Olson's.

Olson's comments are cheap heat for certain.

Quotein the library which is has been vocal about noise being 'dead'

Well they always tell you to "Shhh" in libraries to be fair

Quote from: jesusfaggotchrist on December 07, 2013, 09:55:09 PM
coming from an entry-level band, that's not saying much. besides they're probably just saying this because they lost their equipment in a house fire. sour grapes.

Olzone has been doing stuff since the early nineties apart from Wolf Eyes.

Olson goofs around a lot. I imagine this interview was conducted in person, because in person his goofy /funny talkisn't so pronounced, but he was led on by the interviewer, and still was pretty goofy. I've talked to him in person many times, and even since he's been straight edge (although I saw a picture that appeared to show him smoking recently, he didn't smoke this summer) he goofs around.

I don't know why people took that so seriously. If you've taken even a perfunctory glance at his other interviews, it should be quite obvious.

Trip Metal?

(Pretty much impossible to edit anything on my phone. Sorry if there are more mistakes, I've been ripping my hair out correcting the last three.)

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 09, 2013, 10:28:35 AM
(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e50/tinnitustimulus/Screenshot3_zps858f2c0e.png)
from David Novak's Japanoise

THIS. And many other quotes in that book.

It's good that the hipsters are gone. Maybe not for business, but at least we can get "back to business".

Noise is dead. It's died many times. Long live noise.

Quote from: Jordan on December 14, 2013, 09:59:36 AM

I don't know why people took that so seriously. If you've taken even a perfunctory glance at his other interviews, it should be quite obvious.

This board made up of a lot of Europeans who are not familiar with Olson personally and wouldn't try to know him anyways. There is a lot of resonation with the times with his statement with the New Harsh Noise thread earlier this year, and I think some people have been tired of Wolf Eyes since 2004. Frankly, I would rather see people over react about the whole thing and try to prove him wrong then explain his joker mentality. Not that people around here like a good joke anyways.

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 14, 2013, 10:59:50 AM
Frankly, I would rather see people over react about the whole thing and try to prove him wrong then explain his joker mentality. Not that people around here like a good joke anyways.

Maybe earlier he should prove why 'NOISE IS OVER"?

Quote from: ImpulsyStetoskopu on December 14, 2013, 11:36:06 AM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 14, 2013, 10:59:50 AM
Frankly, I would rather see people over react about the whole thing and try to prove him wrong then explain his joker mentality. Not that people around here like a good joke anyways.

Maybe earlier he should prove why 'NOISE IS OVER"?

Who? Olson? nobody needs to prove anything but it's nice to see some people around get huffy and go "noise never died, wtf?" as someone who still plays the basements of America but playing to more experimental jazz, techno, synth and indescribable acts than real harsh noise most of the time. Not that I mind that.

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 14, 2013, 11:07:05 PM

Quote from: ImpulsyStetoskopu on December 14, 2013, 11:36:06 AM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 14, 2013, 10:59:50 AM
Frankly, I would rather see people over react about the whole thing and try to prove him wrong then explain his joker mentality. Not that people around here like a good joke anyways.

Maybe earlier he should prove why 'NOISE IS OVER"?

Who? Olson? nobody needs to prove anything but it's nice to see some people around get huffy and go "noise never died, wtf?" as someone who still plays the basements of America but playing to more experimental jazz, techno, synth and indescribable acts than real harsh noise most of the time. Not that I mind that.

Olson as an American Dream Star - did you want to say that? Somebody has to prove somethiing but he mustn't that...  Well, everyone has got its god what they deserve.

Quote from: ImpulsyStetoskopu on December 15, 2013, 01:03:34 AM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 14, 2013, 11:07:05 PM

Quote from: ImpulsyStetoskopu on December 14, 2013, 11:36:06 AM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 14, 2013, 10:59:50 AM
Frankly, I would rather see people over react about the whole thing and try to prove him wrong then explain his joker mentality. Not that people around here like a good joke anyways.

Maybe earlier he should prove why 'NOISE IS OVER"?

Who? Olson? nobody needs to prove anything but it's nice to see some people around get huffy and go "noise never died, wtf?" as someone who still plays the basements of America but playing to more experimental jazz, techno, synth and indescribable acts than real harsh noise most of the time. Not that I mind that.

Olson as an American Dream Star - did you want to say that? Somebody has to prove somethiing but he mustn't that...  Well, everyone has got its god what they deserve.

Well Mr Olson said it was dead, so I guess he was expecting everyone to sell their DOD Death Metals and buy tickets to the next Wolf Eyes stadium event where Rush opens for them. Oh well, better tell him he's wrong cause I'm sure he is listening.

I don't know about you, but I don't seek proof from what I already see is trying to fuck with you. And Olson isn't as much of a god to me as he is a fucker (just try to read his article in As Loud As Possible, ugh.) However, these discussions this has caused have been quite good, you have to admit. Some tough bro posturing in this thread in particular but also very insightful points.

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 15, 2013, 04:39:07 AM

Oh well, better tell him he's wrong cause I'm sure he is listening.

OK, we are fucking him and he is fucking us. So, maybe you will tell me why NOISE IS OVER?

Quote from: Cementimental on December 13, 2013, 02:46:19 PM

Quotein the library which is has been vocal about noise being 'dead'

Well they always tell you to "Shhh" in libraries to be fair

OOh, I forgot about that, there's me throwing off sharp high frequencies and shouting about my pubes being on fire in the silent study area, I don't see why you're laughing at me, THEY BANNED ME FOR TWO WEEKS!!!!!!! Here's to online study.

I wanna do some tough Bro posturing too!

How do you do it?

Quote from: ImpulsyStetoskopu on December 15, 2013, 11:19:34 AM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 15, 2013, 04:39:07 AM

Oh well, better tell him he's wrong cause I'm sure he is listening.

OK, we are fucking him and he is fucking us. So, maybe you will tell me why NOISE IS OVER?

A lot of people started at the same time and are now burned out from producing it at least, like silvum, though he was not someone who made noise. nothing that significant or special that's going on, it's basically like 1985 with all the first generation Industrial bands (eg SPK's Gold and Poison, Nocturnal Emissions, uncommunity to mccarthey to Stereolab) and what I quoted from Japanoise. The only difference was that this was a US scene that came together at one central point thanks to the internet (Which created things like these msg boards, email lists, No Fun Fest etc). Before the internet, its hard for me to assume what went on, but it had an elusiveness that is not there anymore and required more dedication to know what's going on. Maybe No Fun Fest is over, but now there is a bunch of noise fests happening in the US all over the place, all year round, but it is uncentralized. If had the time and money to attend all of these damn things, I'd probably see more people into noise then ever, even if there isn't a write up of the "headliners" in the Wire. This could be part of the millions of one way conversations he was talking about.

It is also pretty ridiculous to think "hippie" noise is dead, Smegma was on the other side of that Non 7" after all, and neither have ceased operations after all these years. The funny thing to me is that the first time I saw Nyodene D I was in Voice of the Valley, probably one of the more "hippier" of the fests here despite having some other decent pe acts like New Pledgemaster, etc. So much for an abortion.

So, for you, as I understood well, the main reason of NOISE IS OVER is an uncentralized cirle of noise artists?

Yeah finding NEW stuff that sticks out to me is not as easy either, though also find plenty of noise I used to listen to in the 00s to be not as good as I remembered it to be. I'm more excited about anything released before 1985 for most genres of music now, but I also see that as just getting older, personally. By a certain point you know what you want and you go towards that direction, and find it harder to look elsewhere.

This year it's pretty hard for me to make top ten album list, even more so than last year, but hey at least there is a list. The Skeleton Dust Contemporary Harsh Noise series come to mind, Good Area's Dilettante Cassette and this new Vat tape I'm playing and Gene Pick. There certainly isn't a lack of talent but maybe a daunting amount of it, and names I used to follow now play the Boiler Room. Well I still enjoy Container, though maybe that would be too happy for the people around here.

Just for the person asking me why I think NOISE IS DEAD, this year is also the first year I did not self release anything, my tapes put out by 4 different labels and probably played more shows this year than ever, sometimes with enthusiastic audience interactions that have knocked the gear out my table despite people holding it down. For my situation right now, to think noise is dead is just preposterous. Noise is dead to me when I'm dead.

Music is dead, noise is alive.

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 15, 2013, 04:39:07 AM
just try to read his article in As Loud As Possible, ugh

That was one of the most excruciatingly embarrassing pieces of writing I've ever seen and I'm just glad I never wrote things like that. What on earth was he thinking? Makes Thurston Moore's phoney hipster-speak seem bearable.

What I remember of Universal Indians wasn't especially noise, more experimental psych-rock and pretty good stuff. What little I heard of Wolf Eyes didn't do much for me but was maybe good for getting young people interested in the genre for a while.

I am most interested in John Olson's bootlegging activities - pretty sure at least one of the better Velvet Underground vinyl boots of recent years was his doing...

Unexpectedly packed out crowd on a Wednesday night in Leeds this year for a show with Con-Dom, Skullflower, Mutant Ape certainly shows the noise scene isn't dead.

Quote from: SILVUM on December 16, 2013, 11:24:22 PM
  I am happy to just observe on the sidelines, because the next real mutations should prove to be interesting. 

Well said, that's why things don't really die.

Quote from: Jordan on December 14, 2013, 10:02:09 AMNoise is dead. It's died many times. Long live noise.

i was rereading bananafish 13 (1999?) recently and remembered this quote from olson after all this noise is dead argy-bargy ...

Quote from: John OlsonEarly noise was great, but it killed itself really quickly. I think the problem was that all those guys decided they had to be louder than everyone else and it just developed into this bassy crunch by 1997.

ha! but, yeah, i totally agree with this ...

Quote from: Jordan on December 14, 2013, 09:59:36 AMI don't know why people took that so seriously. If you've taken even a perfunctory glance at his other interviews, it should be quite obvious.

i mean, trip metal! it's pretty obvious he's goofin' off here. the intent is about a million miles away from something like david keenan coining some shit like hypnagogic pop.

Quote from: HongKongGoolagong on December 16, 2013, 07:19:55 PM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 15, 2013, 04:39:07 AM
just try to read his article in As Loud As Possible, ugh

That was one of the most excruciatingly embarrassing pieces of writing I've ever seen and I'm just glad I never wrote things like that. What on earth was he thinking? Makes Thurston Moore's phoney hipster-speak seem bearable.

i know i'm probably in the vast minority here but his piece in alap was one of my favourite things in there. i'll miss his american tapes inzanity updates when he folds the label

I loved that article too and I love his jive talk and stupid, dumb aesthetic. He knows exactly what he is doing and it definitely ISN'T making serious attempts to define the status of some genre.

Quote from: ddmurph on December 17, 2013, 09:01:09 PM

Quote from: John OlsonEarly noise was great, but it killed itself really quickly. I think the problem was that all those guys decided they had to be louder than everyone else and it just developed into this bassy crunch by 1997.

ha! but, yeah, i totally agree with this ...

HNW "killed" it? I could agree with the sentiment that it can't really take it any further in that regard. I like plenty of walls like anybody else, but I'm certainly not excited to hear about new artists doing Vomiresque strict HNW.

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 17, 2013, 10:47:31 PM

Quote from: ddmurph on December 17, 2013, 09:01:09 PM

Quote from: John OlsonEarly noise was great, but it killed itself really quickly. I think the problem was that all those guys decided they had to be louder than everyone else and it just developed into this bassy crunch by 1997.

ha! but, yeah, i totally agree with this ...

HNW "killed" it? I could agree with the sentiment that it can't really take it any further in that regard. I like plenty of walls like anybody else, but I'm certainly not excited to hear about new artists doing Vomiresque strict HNW.

nah, i meant i agree with not taking olson's comments seriously

This thread reminds me... still have some gaps to fill in my D.L. Savings T.X collection.

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 17, 2013, 10:47:31 PM

Quote from: ddmurph on December 17, 2013, 09:01:09 PM

Quote from: John OlsonEarly noise was great, but it killed itself really quickly. I think the problem was that all those guys decided they had to be louder than everyone else and it just developed into this bassy crunch by 1997.

ha! but, yeah, i totally agree with this ...

HNW "killed" it? I could agree with the sentiment that it can't really take it any further in that regard. I like plenty of walls like anybody else, but I'm certainly not excited to hear about new artists doing Vomiresque strict HNW.

I think it's good topic of discussion. I think it has been discussed before in some threads. Not that noise was killed by noise (hah!), but looking from perspective of diversity of old noise, and what later days qualified as "noise", seems worth consideration.

IF noise was only describing electronic signal DISTORTION, then it would make sense to call "HNW" or "harsh noise" as logical end. If we consider noise not only as distortion of signal, but also sound(work) that is distracting, disturbing, "unwanted", etc. Dynamic stability of HNW makes it often pleasant rather than.. "noisy". While high dynamic variation, and disturbing "anti-composition" would appear to me noisier. If noise becomes most of all soothing muzak, then some people want antimusic. It may be just something like Gerogerigegege "Hotel Ultra". It's like being in annoying situation where some people talk, some annoying noises distracts and snippets of music you didn't want to hear come and go. All sorts of "unwanted noise" instead of pleasant silence or innovative distortion composition.

Quote from: FreakAnimalFinland on December 28, 2013, 12:09:13 PM

Quote from: tinnitustimulus on December 17, 2013, 10:47:31 PM

Quote from: ddmurph on December 17, 2013, 09:01:09 PM

Quote from: John OlsonEarly noise was great, but it killed itself really quickly. I think the problem was that all those guys decided they had to be louder than everyone else and it just developed into this bassy crunch by 1997.

ha! but, yeah, i totally agree with this ...

HNW "killed" it? I could agree with the sentiment that it can't really take it any further in that regard. I like plenty of walls like anybody else, but I'm certainly not excited to hear about new artists doing Vomiresque strict HNW.

I think it's good topic of discussion. I think it has been discussed before in some threads. Not that noise was killed by noise (hah!), but looking from perspective of diversity of old noise, and what later days qualified as "noise", seems worth consideration.

IF noise was only describing electronic signal DISTORTION, then it would make sense to call "HNW" or "harsh noise" as logical end. If we consider noise not only as distortion of signal, but also sound(work) that is distracting, disturbing, "unwanted", etc. Dynamic stability of HNW makes it often pleasant rather than.. "noisy". While high dynamic variation, and disturbing "anti-composition" would appear to me noisier. If noise becomes most of all soothing muzak, then some people want antimusic. It may be just something like Gerogerigegege "Hotel Ultra". It's like being in annoying situation where some people talk, some annoying noises distracts and snippets of music you didn't want to hear come and go. All sorts of "unwanted noise" instead of pleasant silence or innovative distortion composition.

Seeing the "progression" of Yellow Tears really got into that territory:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjtW9_1KGwU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjtW9_1KGwU)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnWBBcpnZy8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnWBBcpnZy8)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPFKaZx0wDU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPFKaZx0wDU)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsJ8mEldLH0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsJ8mEldLH0)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHQBAwmD-aE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHQBAwmD-aE)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8tgxw8unik (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8tgxw8unik)

I was at the ride, it was mildly amusing at the time, but compared to what I have seen previously, I was disturbed for future of seeing those who get bored of innovative distortion composition

Yep, I don't feel "distortion compositions" have reached any sort of end with their possibilities. Still greatly more possibilities than within melody or typical steady rhythms.

It just seems like the natural ebb and flow of any scene, whether it is visual, audio or fashion.  And you shouldn't blame Wolf Eyes for their legions that they influenced, that is like blaming Black Sabbath for Warrant.  There is good stuff being made all the time, but people get older and priorities change.  Greatness doesn't hide but the deluge of crap can make it harder to find.  The internet seemed to kill some of the mystery of some bands, but like Keith said, it helps me save money by hearing samples.

no remorse

I saw Wolf Eyes play recently in Chicago, and it was telling that Peter Sotos left before they began.

Quote from: FreakAnimalFinland on December 28, 2013, 12:09:13 PM
IF noise was only describing electronic signal DISTORTION, then it would make sense to call "HNW" or "harsh noise" as logical end. ... or innovative distortion composition.

It seems almost inevitable that discussions on the value (or "life") of noise fall back to conjecture on the appropriate terminology.

Noise. "What is noise?" It is just a word, but no it's not just a word. It is, in fact, a word which existed long, long before noise as a field of sonic endeavor was recognized. It's a word which existed long, long before English as a language was recognized. It's a word which probably existed long, long before the idea of "words" as a means of communication was recognized. (That is to say, a fixed idea of noise existed long, long before it was a word.)

Compare to, for instance: power electronics, drum 'n bass, rock 'n roll, jazz, classical. These were terms offered as descriptors of the created, after the fact of their creation was recognized. (There may be exceptions, and I'm working on it. I, Bloated Slutbag, hereby declare my intention to create a completely NEW field of sonic endeavor which I've dubbed, in an effort to beat critics to the punch, "Buttfuck Wibes". I haven't heard it yet, but BY FUCK I'll know it when I hear it. Buttfuck Wibes. Coming to a record store near you. Ahem.)

When noise was first "created", packaged, released for general consumption... it simply became what already was. It became the dictionary definition of itself. Noise. Play the recording. Check your dictionary. Yep. That's noise, through and through. Incapacitants - Feedback of NMS. Press play. Look up the dictionary definitions of "harsh" and "noise". (Is Bloated implying that the idea of "harsh noise" existed long, long before we even had words to describe it? Yes he is. And he will continue to do so. Until the bottle is empty.) Any questions?

Objection to the above, #1. Bu-

But. The instant you decide you "want" to hear it, the dictionary definition starts to break down. And at least one idea of noise - "unwanted sound" - "dies". But this is a minority view eg. mine, yours, the whole of the Special Interests network... on a global scale, we are, put simply, nothing. absolutely nothing. get used to it....  (Here again we are necessarily privileging one idea, or description, of noise over another; so, "What is noise?" No really, What. The Fuck. Is It?

EDIT:[snip]

Don't know about you folks. But for the last twenty years, trying to nail down my idea of what noise may or may not be, not to mention how much "life" it's got, has provided at least as much pointless distraction as making noise, listening to noise, and pretty much any other pass-time to be thought of, noise-related and otherwise.

So, to the question "What is noise?" the answer "It is dead" seems woefully inadequate.

Close brackets.)

For me, noise dies when the I can successfully listen to the first three minutes of Incapacitants "Feedback of NMS" without my mind being blown (notwithstanding the fact that track 2 is better still....) Will let you know when I get there, assuming of course I'm not dead.

Note to self: refrain from posting whilst under the influence. Will leave it anyway as there are one or two legitimate sentiments buried in there, especially the one about pointless degenerative pass-times...

yeah it was no worse than most noise board posts :D

I'd like that etched on my headstone:
"He was no worse than most noiseboard posters."

"Bloated Slutbag:
born 1975 in Toronto;
with the love of Christ;
died 2013* in agony;
with a DOD up his bottom."

*The Year Noise Died

Quote
a DOD up his bottom

lol