Mental Illness Representation in PE/Noise

[FreakAnimalFinland]

Perhaps whilst it's mentioned, Physical Illness Representation in PE/Noise could be an interesting topic too? I checked out the Discogs page of a respected artist in the scene and was very saddened to hear of recent public news owing to their retirement that had been added to their biography in the last few months. Don't want to name them specifically as it's still obviously a delicate matter, but I really hope he is able to make a full recovery.

I would suspect anyone with discogs account could see who made the edits and request it to be removed.

In finland, I would think Atrophist is example where project name directly refers to personal condition. It is not like project would revolve around it nor really crave for attention. When you see him live, I guess name suddenly makes sense.

But i'm pretty cautious about tackling this subject matter in contemporary way, where individual's own lived experience is raised into pedestal instead of using it as an vehicle to observe the state of humanity or certain societies or some aspects of them etc.

I recent times, I have come across at least three releases, where main part of the artwork of a release is artists in hospital bed. Be it suicidal behavior, medical condition or being victim of violence, still, first thing what I feel is expression.... narcissism? Of course that too, is a mental health condition when going to excessive level. It is curious difference of "artist photo" and "selfie", that is hard to put in words, but seems very obvious when you see it. And noise release that constitutes qualities of "selfie", seems a bit different thing than piece of art.

[Kayandah]

Artist himself made the edits far as I can see

[Commander15]

I recent times, I have come across at least three releases, where main part of the artwork of a release is artists in hospital bed. Be it suicidal behavior, medical condition or being victim of violence, still, first thing what I feel is expression.... narcissism? Of course that too, is a mental health condition when going to excessive level. It is curious difference of "artist photo" and "selfie", that is hard to put in words, but seems very obvious when you see it. And noise release that constitutes qualities of "selfie", seems a bit different thing than piece of art.

I certainly agree with you on your notions of narcissism and selfies. Might it be that those examples you gave are examples of social validation phenomenon seeping through from social media to the realm of industrial and noise? That has been all the rage past few years recieving lots of media coverage etc. I feel that it is closely connected with the self-victimization and gaining some kind of social leverage by assuming the position of an victim.

[tiny_tove]

Very nice thread, I have a little confession to make on the topic.

For the third time in my life my mind has been affecting my body and daily life compromising many things and this is surely influencing my own work, not only because of slowing down/stopping activities having people being disappointed at me, but also as a different approach to sound. More painful, more repetitive, etc.
Nothing news.

I don't have a mental disorder, I'm not mentally ill, but not being fully operative due to a temporary condition that previously affected other members in my family as I have been is really rising difficulties.

The next wertham full length has been in the works for over a decade, it's entitled Bodies under siege and started as an external observation of specific issues people have with the unacceptance of their bodies, but it's s slowly turning into a personal experience about really living my own mind and body as an enemy. Nothing new and nothing as extreme as other works, even of "acclaimed" contemporary artists who were obsessed with the same topic from the  60s onwards, but I think it works in PE context. I always tried to observe from the outside the topics I used in concept, often impersonating the characters using the "I/Me" rather than the "them/they" (no non-binary pun intended). Now this detachment I always had is becoming difficult to use.

Atrax Morgue, SPK, Stabat Mors and many otherse went deep in these topics in very sensitive way.

[Commander15]

Very nice thread, I have a little confession to make on the topic.

For the third time in my life my mind has been affecting my body and daily life compromising many things and this is surely influencing my own work, not only because of slowing down/stopping activities having people being disappointed at me, but also as a different approach to sound. More painful, more repetitive, etc.
Nothing news.

I don't have a mental disorder, I'm not mentally ill, but not being fully operative due to a temporary condition that previously affected other members in my family as I have been is really rising difficulties.

The next wertham full length has been in the works for over a decade, it's entitled Bodies under siege and started as an external observation of specific issues people have with the unacceptance of their bodies, but it's s slowly turning into a personal experience about really living my own mind and body as an enemy. Nothing new and nothing as extreme as other works, even of "acclaimed" contemporary artists who were obsessed with the same topic from the  60s onwards, but I think it works in PE context. I always tried to observe from the outside the topics I used in concept, often impersonating the characters using the "I/Me" rather than the "them/they" (no non-binary pun intended). Now this detachment I always had is becoming difficult to use.

Atrax Morgue, SPK, Stabat Mors and many otherse went deep in these topics in very sensitive way.

One's own body as an enemy, or other body horror of a sort, could be a fruitful theme. I've toyed with an idea  of doing some multiple sclerosis -themed art as i've had MS for about 10 years, but in the end it felt a bit too... Self-centered and uninteresting, at least to me. I think that long-term illnesses in general are good themes for noise / industrial, nothing wrong with them at all.

[Balor/SS1535]

I recent times, I have come across at least three releases, where main part of the artwork of a release is artists in hospital bed. Be it suicidal behavior, medical condition or being victim of violence, still, first thing what I feel is expression.... narcissism? Of course that too, is a mental health condition when going to excessive level. It is curious difference of "artist photo" and "selfie", that is hard to put in words, but seems very obvious when you see it. And noise release that constitutes qualities of "selfie", seems a bit different thing than piece of art.

I certainly agree with you on your notions of narcissism and selfies. Might it be that those examples you gave are examples of social validation phenomenon seeping through from social media to the realm of industrial and noise? That has been all the rage past few years recieving lots of media coverage etc. I feel that it is closely connected with the self-victimization and gaining some kind of social leverage by assuming the position of an victim.

It's interesting that this comes up---there is a guy I have connected with over social media who does death industrial, but he seems to spend a lot more time posting selfies on Facebook then doing music.  I find it sort of off-putting, but then I remember that Atrax Morgue took a lot of pictures of himself too.  Still, they feel different.  I'm not entirely certain if I am fair in being fine with one but not the other, thought.

[Andrew McIntosh]

I find it sort of off-putting, but then I remember that Atrax Morgue took a lot of pictures of himself too.  Still, they feel different.  I'm not entirely certain if I am fair in being fine with one but not the other, thought.

Marco did a lot more than just take photos of himself, though. He established his own specific sound with AM. He put out a billion releases, of his own and others' work, including many collaborations. He established himself in the scene and is rightly respected today. I don't know the other chap you're referring to, but putting pictures of yourself on FB is not in the same league as Marco's work.

[Cranial Blast]

I find it sort of off-putting, but then I remember that Atrax Morgue took a lot of pictures of himself too.  Still, they feel different.  I'm not entirely certain if I am fair in being fine with one but not the other, thought.

Marco did a lot more than just take photos of himself, though. He established his own specific sound with AM. He put out a billion releases, of his own and others' work, including many collaborations. He established himself in the scene and is rightly respected today. I don't know the other chap you're referring to, but putting pictures of yourself on FB is not in the same league as Marco's work.

I think the social media phenomenon of this narcissistic self preservation of every trivial self life moment and "selfie" is a bit of a disorder in it's own right. Why would anyone on earth want to curate any and every stupid moment of their time spent on this planet and who is going to look back at it when they are dust to dust to even grasp an understanding of it in any true meaningful understanding anyways? I cannot for the life of me relate to this idea. I remember back in the Myspace days and that was like a precursor for the almighty Facebook to become. I think some thought this sucked and abandoned ship and others stayed with it and it's just another more modern annoying continuation of that same self preservation through mundane moments of life that are really not so special. It's NOT like a picture or random viewed photograph. A picture is worth a thousand words, a social media/Instagram/FB picture is a picture of you writing about your own stupid picture giving it a specific commentary of exactly what it's "all about" or what you experienced and how a bunch of other likeminded narcissistic type can also chime in how they can relate with their own life experience related to it by sending a slew of photos of the same shit. I dunno...maybe I'm a bit callous and cold towards social media, but I see it as the biggest waste of human life/time in the entirety of mankind. Also I think it leads people to becoming lesser and more insecure human beings, despite their falsified grandstanding narcissism as they are so consumed by this "one up" mentality. Social media in my opinion is ridden in toxicity to the highest degree and I'm humbly awaiting the day when social media will be remembered like smoking in a resturant, smoking or no smoking? Those days of the past are becoming like a blip in memory, at least for most of us living in America, as if those days never even existed, that's where I hope social media will reside, in faint memory of the past.

[Balor/SS1535]

I find it sort of off-putting, but then I remember that Atrax Morgue took a lot of pictures of himself too.  Still, they feel different.  I'm not entirely certain if I am fair in being fine with one but not the other, thought.

Marco did a lot more than just take photos of himself, though. He established his own specific sound with AM. He put out a billion releases, of his own and others' work, including many collaborations. He established himself in the scene and is rightly respected today. I don't know the other chap you're referring to, but putting pictures of yourself on FB is not in the same league as Marco's work.

Well yes, that is obviously true.  Regardless of circumstances, I still find the tendency to take pictures of yourself strange---but he can be forgiven!

[tiny_tove]

I find it sort of off-putting, but then I remember that Atrax Morgue took a lot of pictures of himself too.  Still, they feel different.  I'm not entirely certain if I am fair in being fine with one but not the other, thought.

Marco did a lot more than just take photos of himself, though. He established his own specific sound with AM. He put out a billion releases, of his own and others' work, including many collaborations. He established himself in the scene and is rightly respected today. I don't know the other chap you're referring to, but putting pictures of yourself on FB is not in the same league as Marco's work.

Photos and portraits with other people and self-portraits were 100% as important as his sound. What other express with complex texts and manifesto he did with his body and aestetic.

I can't remember if he even had a social profile.

[Balor/SS1535]

I find it sort of off-putting, but then I remember that Atrax Morgue took a lot of pictures of himself too.  Still, they feel different.  I'm not entirely certain if I am fair in being fine with one but not the other, thought.

Marco did a lot more than just take photos of himself, though. He established his own specific sound with AM. He put out a billion releases, of his own and others' work, including many collaborations. He established himself in the scene and is rightly respected today. I don't know the other chap you're referring to, but putting pictures of yourself on FB is not in the same league as Marco's work.

Photos and portraits with other people and self-portraits were 100% as important as his sound. What other express with complex texts and manifesto he did with his body and aestetic.

I can't remember if he even had a social profile.

He really is very much like Mishima (who also did many self-portraits).  I think the other difference between Marco and the other guy that I mention, is the sheer oversaturation of images now.  If you are in contact with letters or over early email with some guy across the world/country doing something like Atrax Morgue did, there is a compelling reason to want to share who you are and/or see who you are interacting with.  Now, however, trying to do what might have been appropriate/interesting then can easily slide into unwarranted self-aggrandizing (at best) or show that you are just another social media attention-seeker (the most common, and likely worst, option).

Wasn't there an Atrax Morgue Myspace page? I could have sworn I came across it before, but it might have been a fan-made thing.

[tiny_tove]

[
Wasn't there an Atrax Morgue Myspace page? I could have sworn I came across it before, but it might have been a fan-made thing.

I can't really remember. I saw several social pages popping up after his death, but can't really recall.
BTW you got my point with the Mishima connection.

[Balor/SS1535]

[
Wasn't there an Atrax Morgue Myspace page? I could have sworn I came across it before, but it might have been a fan-made thing.

BTW you got my point with the Mishima connection.

That's good.  Hopefully I'm not coming across obstinate or anything---I hold all of Marco's work in the highest esteem.  My questioning with the pictures is sort of an "after the fact" thing of looking at this guy who is obviously trying very hard to be like Atrax Morgue, but obviously falling short.

[tiny_tove]

. Most often as excuses for whatever they have going on in life.

how many non autistic people claim to be?
how many lazy people claim to simply be affected by attention deficit disorder?
how many attention-seeking masochists claim to be into pathological self-harm?
how many self-proclaim to be OCD without never being tested by the real thing?
how many confuse temporary social-anxiety (especially post lockdown) with being unable to get out of your shell/travel/be among people for the real thing?

I've knownn and met people with these issues long before social media thing, before people claimed mental health as a trend on social status and they are completely in a different planet that self-diagnosed gits.

It really pisses me off using alleged mental health issues as a badge of honor and a justification without really being suffering of that. Sure there are several levels of all these issues, and many individuals are functional and semi-functional in society (as said I'm having issues myself at the moment, but I go to work, do my shopping, and care about my agin/ill parents), but I see this fake medicalisation of society both as an excuse and as a need of being part of a weird alternative status/society, necessarry to have a minority status.
The fakes don't behave like the true thing, they simply identify in a caricature of that.

[anomalie]

. Most often as excuses for whatever they have going on in life.

how many non autistic people claim to be?

I've knownn and met people with these issues long before social media thing, before people claimed mental health as a trend on social status and they are completely in a different planet that self-diagnosed gits.

It really pisses me off using alleged mental health issues as a badge of honor and a justification without really being suffering of that.

The fakes don't behave like the true thing, they simply identify in a caricature of that.

Thank you very much for that statement.

If someone is truly affected by mental health problems, it's no fun. It's suffering. It destroys.