Mental Illness Representation in PE/Noise

Started by bodyofacrow, February 15, 2024, 11:00:33 PM

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bodyofacrow

I figured this would be a pretty interesting thread to start. I thought about throwing the essay in the Whitehouse thread however I'm also curious to see what everyone else has to post here. If my writing is poor I apologize, just wanted to write down my thoughts. I'm not super intricate with my lanuage so this won't be entirely formal.


***WARNING FOR DISCUSSION OF POTENTIALLY SENSITIVE TOPICS***


BPD = Borderline Personality Disorder
pwBPD = Person with BPD





Mental illness isn't really an uncommon topic at all in noise music, and as a pwBPD, I found myself morbidly relating to the song 'Cut Hands Has the Solution' by Whitehouse. From what I see online, I think people overall interpret it as a song about self harm, eating disorders too, the "I know you're a slow, fussy pathetic eater" line adds up for that but, I can't help but look deeply into the lyrics of this song and see the worst parts of my life be so linearly represented.

With my experience in my own BPD, I feel like a prisoner in my own mind a lot of the time. When addressing my feelings, sharing my own ailments with people such as my favorite person I feel the need to refer to my feelings as a seperate entity. I feel like this is just because I wish so badly it could be different and I could 'fix' myself. I'm saying things like "My BPD makes me think (So and So)" or "My BPD is freaking out" so on and so forth. I am self aware of these things, my distorted thoughts are wrong, but it doesn't make it feel any less real inside to acknowledge that they're distorted. They just are. It's how I feel in the moment.
I see this song as a narrator speaking to an individual, in this case 'Cut Hands'... and the way I am interpreting it, Cut hands would be the entity. Cut Hands is BPD speaking to a pwBPD's brain. Cut Hands reminds you that you're aware of these things, and yet you can't do much to help yourself. Even the title (and i suppose also a line in the song) "Cut Hands Has The Solution", the solution in question would be to commit suicide. An phenomenon in BPD is a pwBPD will often feel like the only way to fix themselves is to end their life. I am now going to highlight specific lines in the lyrics that resonate with me.

"I'll tell you:
It's helping
I'll tell you:
You're doing the right thing"

I just touched on this a moment before. Viewing the song as written as described above as BPD or 'Cut Hands' speaking to the pwBPD's conciousness, I interpret this as again the pwBPD is aware of their actions, how self harm and other depracating behaviors are ultimately hurting them in the long run, yet over and over they will have this voice (Cut Hands) inside their heads that tells them to do it. That it's ok, it's what you need to do and it is helping you.

"I can see you're used
And I don't know where you've been
But I do know past failures still haunt you"

Dwelling on past mistakes, past traumas actively affecting you even if it was years or decades ago. This might also be a comment on failed suicide attempts.

"Thoughtless slow remarks you later regret
It's hard to own up and take the blame
For being a nervous gibbering wreck
So go on be a careless fucking onlooker
So you can sit and not-think about pain"

In episodes, a pwBPD fails to rationalize. They can say things they don't mean, or that they word harshly in the heat of their own emotions consuming them. They feel guilty for this, they feel an immense amount of dread. This leads to a pwBPD to isolate themselves from other people for this. They fear abandonment, and they know these behaviors cause people to leave them. So, they feel the only solution to this is to isolate themselves and not let themselves get close to anyone. On the off chance that they might fuck it up. The idea of being abandoned after a connection to us is worse.

"Question: did you ever hurt yourself to make somebody sorry?
How often do you pretend to be sick?
You ever wanted something very much but never told anybody about it?
Are you such a slug you can't live without a fucking sundae?
You ever made a bit too much fuss over your cuts?
Yes, the cutting will be quite dramatic
If you get the crisscross slit right
And show an exposed piece of bone
Ready for the harvest"

PwBPD struggle with self harm. Not all, but a majority. It is one of the points you can hit in the diagnostic criteria.

"You'll learn about the kitty-cut
Before the privilege of seeing your own blood
I'll let you suck brown-brown and clairil
So you know how papa's so brave
I'll show you the wide-awake nightmare
And now you can buy some fucking fear"

BPD feels like a living nightmare, such trauma happens at a young age and pwBPD can often even start self harming at a very young age.


"So new question: can you:
Spot a person who's like me?
Can you: imagine
A difference between their body and yours?
Can you: imagine
A person who looks like you?
Could you:
Spot a person who looks unlike you?
Can you:
Spot a person who's how you want to be?
Can you:
Imagine a person who you'd never want to be?"

The lack of a stable identity within BPD ties into this.

At the very end it says:
"Cut hands has the solution
We'll feed you to every hungry bird
We'll feed you to every starving animal
And we'll let them eat fat till they're full
And will let them drink blood till they're drunk
As I tell you:
It's helping
While I tell you:
You're doing the right thing"

Even after you've destroyed yourself, your relationships, or your own body, giving up parts of yourself, you'll do it again and again, because you have no idea how to break out of the cycle.


There are parts I missed in this song that I could have annotated, but hopefully this perspective was interesting to read! I'm sure the literal meaning of the song is somewhat different but this is how I saw it.





Feel free to also share some songs that either have similar themes to this or you think could be interpreted in that way! I'd love to read and discuss
~~~~~~~~ REPRESENTING THE HAPPIEST PLACE ON EARTH~~~~~~~
 1334
NOW YOU CAN BE GOD, TOO!
 1334
IT's EASY... AND WE'LL SHOW YOU HOW
 1334
~~~~~~~~ REPRESENTING THE HAPPIEST PLACE ON EARTH~~~~~~~

Balor/SS1535

We have content warnings in power electronics now?

That said, you have a unique analysis of the track that I would never have considered.

bodyofacrow

Quote from: Balor/SS1535 on February 16, 2024, 04:42:17 AMWe have content warnings in power electronics now?

That said, you have a unique analysis of the track that I would never have considered.

Thanks for reading. About the content warnings, I just try to have courtesy, even if it is a power electronics forum.
~~~~~~~~ REPRESENTING THE HAPPIEST PLACE ON EARTH~~~~~~~
 1334
NOW YOU CAN BE GOD, TOO!
 1334
IT's EASY... AND WE'LL SHOW YOU HOW
 1334
~~~~~~~~ REPRESENTING THE HAPPIEST PLACE ON EARTH~~~~~~~

Cranial Blast

#3
I think in some regard whether it be the listener or the artist itself, that mental illness can play a bit of a synonymous role to the genre in some ways. I'm not sure if I'm on topic or not, but I've always found mental illness to be a top topic of interest, especially for my own project Void Of Empathy. I put out a tape a little while back called In The Company Of Infirmity and it's about two things and the idea of those two things joined together at my grandma's death. Those things being actual clinical sickness with brain tumor and dying under hospice care and the other being "family" history of mental illness. Her very last words to me in hospice care was "don't you ever get sick of being around sick people?" which is a profound thing to say or question to ask and it could mean absolutely nothing, or it could mean something and I took as aren't you sick of being around "mental" people, as it personally made the most sense to me in that context. Keith Brewer's work in both Taint and Mania comes to mind in this topic too. It seems like to me that Mania is the dangerous result of neglected or unchecked mental illness that grows and festers into something absolutely grotesque.

prolapsedlielack

Quote from: Cranial Blast on February 17, 2024, 09:58:52 PMIt seems like to me that Mania is the dangerous result of neglected or unchecked mental illness that grows and festers into something absolutely grotesque.

hit the nail on the head. Mania always struck as me something more heavy-hitting in terms of meaning than Taint, though I love both projects (RIP Keith). A good example would be the Isolation Is Lonely Murder release from 2007, really hammers that point you made.

FreakAnimalFinland

It feels very contemporary topic. One could also ask if current age of medicalization of every human characteristic is fruitful?

To me, it often appears that medicalization of society is the problem. Where any unusual quality or emotion is considered sickness, suggests that like opening post says, there is need for potential cure (to become "normal") and there may be self awareness that "disease" is making you do certain things that appears as if you wouldn't function among the rest of population.

I acknowledge seriousness and reality of actual disease, but I also firmly stand in position where assuming conflict free, "normal", and balanced life feel like illusion that got out of hand and to medically adjust entire populations to cope with their feelings of alienation and such...  It doesn't inspire me at all to look into individuals "personality disorder" but wonder why is that a "disorder".

Never done therapy, nor medication. Don't feel there is anything wrong (hah). In certain circumstances when professionals have evaluated what is going on, "personality disorder" is term I see mentioned. If in broad sense it means "long-term patterns of behavior and inner experiences that differ significantly from what is expected", one would rather discuss what exactly is that they'd expect? Of course, I may be now even more balanced gentleman than I was as younger. For decade or more, self diagnosis has grown into such levels I tend to grin in disgust. Young chicks dropping lists of diseases like it's their favorite pop songs of current top-40 list. Most often as excuses for whatever they have going on in life.
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Commander15

It really isn't hard to connect the dots between the modern world and the ever emerging spectrum of mental illnesses as an effects of industrialization and post-industrial developement. Alienation, lost sense of purpose, traditions and customs dismantled, atomization, secularization process... So I think that it is an pretty natural topic in the context of noise / industrial, along with other aspects of human condition.

But i'm pretty cautious about tackling this subject matter in contemporary way, where individual's own lived experience is raised into pedestal instead of using it as an vehicle to observe the state of humanity or certain societies or some aspects of them etc.

Cranial Blast

#7
Quote from: FreakAnimalFinland on February 19, 2024, 08:29:48 AMIt feels very contemporary topic. One could also ask if current age of medicalization of every human characteristic is fruitful?

To me, it often appears that medicalization of society is the problem. Where any unusual quality or emotion is considered sickness, suggests that like opening post says, there is need for potential cure (to become "normal") and there may be self awareness that "disease" is making you do certain things that appears as if you wouldn't function among the rest of population.

I acknowledge seriousness and reality of actual disease, but I also firmly stand in position where assuming conflict free, "normal", and balanced life feel like illusion that got out of hand and to medically adjust entire populations to cope with their feelings of alienation and such...  It doesn't inspire me at all to look into individuals "personality disorder" but wonder why is that a "disorder".

Never done therapy, nor medication. Don't feel there is anything wrong (hah). In certain circumstances when professionals have evaluated what is going on, "personality disorder" is term I see mentioned. If in broad sense it means "long-term patterns of behavior and inner experiences that differ significantly from what is expected", one would rather discuss what exactly is that they'd expect? Of course, I may be now even more balanced gentleman than I was as younger. For decade or more, self diagnosis has grown into such levels I tend to grin in disgust. Young chicks dropping lists of diseases like it's their favorite pop songs of current top-40 list. Most often as excuses for whatever they have going on in life.

Medicalization is precisely the problem indeed. Society's bar is so low to who should be deemed as mentally unfit for a variety of reasons, some of which is to further control people. Also the drug companies make money hand over fist prescribing to anyone that society has deemed as unstable, whether that person is someone going through some temporary and trival mundane grief in life and now has some natural short term depression, or the next Ed Gein with an ever growing psychosis. It's a wide range of things in reality. I've been around enough crazies to know that mental illness is indeed real for some, but nowadays I think we could all be labeled mentally ill, as the bar is just so low haha

deutscheasphalt

Lebensfaden "DESNOS" tape struck me as authentic, although not sure if he actually suffered from CPTSD.
Obviously just contextual interpretation of the sounds since there is are no lyrics and it's doubtful whether materials would be interpreted as dealing with the disorder without artwork/title, but it always felt right.
This is among other tapes great at creating confusing, dissociating atmosphere (for oneself while listening) through sound layers which processing to me was quite progressive for PE at the time.

Theodore

I have a deep dislike for psychologists, i consider it non-science, 95% are charlatans, and a fraud. Give an unknown passerby 30 bucks to discuss with him, he may help you more. People with normal or deeper mental 'problems' , that life brings with it, turn to psychology for 'solutions' . Well, let me sumarize it for you, to save you money and time : There are no real answers, can you accept this ? No ? Then choose one, whatever, that makes you feel OK to move on or to live with it.

Psychiatry is different. It's needed in many cases.
"ἀθάνατοι θνητοί, θνητοὶ ἀθάνατοι, ζῶντες τὸν ἐκείνων θάνατον, τὸν δὲ ἐκείνων βίον τεθνεῶτες"

Stipsi

My two cents:
I was diagnosed with many disorders.
Nothing seems to work perfectly.
Result: I try to stay away from drugs (because they are drugs) as much as i can.

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Cranial Blast

Quote from: Stipsi on February 19, 2024, 08:20:38 PMMy two cents:
I was diagnosed with many disorders.
Nothing seems to work perfectly.
Result: I try to stay away from drugs (because they are drugs) as much as i can.


Exactly, well put and they are simply just that. They are just legalized street drugs by the big pharma cartels and generally don't do anyone any bit of good anyways in the grand scheme. I've been described as having a personality disorder before, but it's like who is defining "disorder"? By who's standard are we measuring this by? Mikko said it best in his post on this topic. Also I believe if people would take it upon themselves to exercise more and try and just be a bit more healthy and disconnect themselves from all mundane social media to, that they'd see they can possibly conqueror any psychological issues that they thought they might of had.

Theodore

We have gone off-topic here but i disagree about drugs. Rejecting them cause they are ... drugs, big pharma etc. makes no meaning. For the same reasons you could reject all medicines for physical illness. Not wise, eh ? The question is : Do you need them ? Do they do less damage than what they treat ?

Rejecting chemistry and real science when they are needed will lead you nowhere. What psychologists hope for. Endless discussions with someone who could have solved his 'problem' with one pill.
"ἀθάνατοι θνητοί, θνητοὶ ἀθάνατοι, ζῶντες τὸν ἐκείνων θάνατον, τὸν δὲ ἐκείνων βίον τεθνεῶτες"

Cranial Blast

Quote from: Theodore on February 19, 2024, 11:09:53 PMWe have gone off-topic here but i disagree about drugs. Rejecting them cause they are ... drugs, big pharma etc. makes no meaning. For the same reasons you could reject all medicines for physical illness. Not wise, eh ? The question is : Do you need them ? Do they do less damage than what they treat ?

Rejecting chemistry and real science when they are needed will lead you nowhere. What psychologists hope for. Endless discussions with someone who could have solved his 'problem' with one pill.

Yeah I hear what your saying and perhaps some people maybe do need the intervention of medication perhaps, but I think there a lot of people today who don't really need mind altering drugs for the everyday mundane human stresses and anxieties of life. The other day I seen a headline that read something like "how to cope with depression when your football team loses" it's like is there where we're headed now? Those are first world problems, not means to become depressed over and what I'm saying is a lot people could just get over that. I don't believe they need Phizer or some drug company to fix something like that and to me it seems like doctors are quick to throw medications out there no matter how insignificant the signs may be. There are some people though who probably need to be medicated for more severe metal disorders, but I don't think that's the cause for most.

theotherjohn

Perhaps whilst it's mentioned, Physical Illness Representation in PE/Noise could be an interesting topic too? I checked out the Discogs page of a respected artist in the scene and was very saddened to hear of recent public news owing to their retirement that had been added to their biography in the last few months. Don't want to name them specifically as it's still obviously a delicate matter, but I really hope he is able to make a full recovery.