Couple episodes that I didn't comment, so I'll do this one with exaggerated length! haha....
Had opportunity to drink beers with Tisbor last weekend, and what a gentleman. When discussion includes not only noise, but Cicciolina, Bulldozer (band), italian raw meat eating habits etc, good topics to discuss!
I would guess that including "filthy artist" brings opportunity to discuss topics in other ways than usually? Many interesting topics for me, but also appear to issues that are often discussed or revolved around, but very few has much idea what to think about it. Not necessarily in WCN podcast, but in general, I think very common way is declaring something "problematic", and... that's that. Which is weird, since if something appears to include problem or difficulty, then to not discuss that exactly, may indicate as if it would be not possible to - if not solve, then better see what it is.
One discussion would the "shock" element in noise. Con-Dom and Death Squad name dropped and question is, would it work these days.
Of course. Why not? One would only have to ask precisely: work how? Tisbor gave example of MK9 show being able to awake feelings and disturb people. Yes, true, they do, but like I mentioned in some reports of MK9 gigs, when being bombarded by videos of injustices americans, or american political system did or does, at least here in Finland, a lot of people take eye contact and nod in ways of.... "hmmm... americans! Haha. We know, dude". Discussed with several people who all have the same feeling. Lets say like project of Cryptofascisme (same artist as Violent Shogun), who investigates ugly details of French history, and suddenly it may be more disturbing as many probably didn't know about things artist is dealing with? With USA related topics, it is more pop news that regardless of how fierce they are, is like entertainment. Just like serial killer eating gay meat for breakfeast, that is now just mass entertainment.
Interesting thing is perhaps exactly that. We know it is "shocking", but does it really shock us? Would it be more shocking realisation that it is so banal that it does NOT cause any distress or anxiety despite seemingly extreme content?
Same with Con-Dom, I would think that one would need to go beyond idea of shock effect, to level that material speaks on matters why it is NOT shocking anymore. Why it might be just... confusing. That could easily open entirely different perspective to deal with material AND yourself, when its not expectation that there is some sort of automatic response it is supposed to cause. I recall Grey Wolves had even manifest of *confusion*, but you never see it being considered as people appear to be so fixed on idea of "shock".
Although, some may be shocked that Tisbor is one of the rare artists featured in any podcast who just flat out says fuck safe spaces and he keeps doing what he does. Of course, not that he would do anything bad. Nevertheless, as principle, even conclude he has no time for such foolishness is something we have not heard in history of WCN before this?
It is curious remark, since just today I watched one music video that had warning text before the music video that it has "blinking lights". I know it is a thing these days, but if you can't turn off video that appears to have blinking lights... come on, jeeeesus. Whatever happens in noise, one would hope there is possibility to advice western youth that do not celebrate becoming retards and imbeciles and even less pretending to be such. It is absolutely possible to say that not everything is "progress", and whatever contemporary foolishness is there, one can be critical about it now.
This "would it work" is also interesting to discuss in previously mentioned question: does it work if its nature shifts into entertainment? We may ask what if nature changes, when it is no longer "it"? There is discussion where Oskar mentions that perhaps Filth & Violence was the pinnacle of that old filthy PE approach and none of the new stuff is really anymore that. It is something else.
I would make bold statement, that in fact F&V does not really directly belong to lineage of old power electronics. None of the Finn PE really belongs. Like GRUNT is as much "Ramleh" as it is "Gerogerigegege" or as "G.O" as "Merzbow". Origins of Bizarre Uproar is not in industrial music or power electronics. This may be key to understand why F&V felt strong and fresh at the time and still does, as it was not copying old UK sound, not 90's USA, not german heavy electronics, it was building something of its own without knowing entire history genre. Not wanting to fit into something pre-existing, but just doing his thing. That there is authentic drive behind it, not even knowning how many may have used topics or sounds before, since it is born and invented inside the artists over and over again without them knowing of eachother. I would think inventing something that is already invented is still vastly different process than following template you see in front of you.
As much as I would admire any former (or current) artist, very rarely trying to be like one formerly existing thing. Merging endless amount of inspirational things together is what makes - hopefully - something that did not formerly exist.
Not wanting nor asking belonging to something, but creation of something or your own may be one of the trademarks of "Finnish noise"? Almost everybody insists they are not part of what others are doing, but couple steps back and you see how the network forms new type of "scene" that perhaps existed nowhere in world before, but also its formless and lawless nature means it just keeps shifting into different shapes.
Oskar asks if Tisbors parents know what's up and man tells story of some sort of assistant of the mother discovering his cock drawings, heh... was it mentioned at what age it happened? Not sure. In my case, back in the day, state/city would enabled free "maid" to help young couples to clean up their houses etc. Couple hours a week. 80's Finland. This cleaning lady ratted me out to my parents, being 6 year old boy spending time modifying coloring books and making drawings with female nipples and pubic hair. "What's wrong with that kid!?!" It may be debatable, but I guess nothing significant. Perhaps just rare case of knowing early on what I like, already as a kid! I liked idea of ladies physique far far more than some hag ratting me out to parents, who luckily didn't mind. Now as grown up man, I feel just about the same. I like, and dislike same mentioned things.
It would not be surprised if in Tisbor interview he could have said he was always into this stuff, and it is not about following "noise standards". It comes very clearly from him. That is how it is with most real-deal guys I have ever talked to. They follow none of expectations or guidelines, they were always into things they involve in their noise. And it doesn't matter if outsides deemed something "old", something "new & exciting", since for creator it doesn't matter. Its not like you'd be creating new entertainment for consumers that requires fulfill their needs. It is artists world were we can take peek if we want to.
Quite many do, actually! Curious is the discussion is the filthy noise "popular" anymore. Tisbor explain some things in very simple way: What if your releases can't be posted to any social media? What is all your videos are being taken down? What if your payment options are shut down. etc. Anyone who has been at certain social media groups where people discuss noise may have seen what can happen if you casually post your favorite CD playing right now.. and you got some can't handle that you actually like it. Most people will soon realize it serves no point to be bickering in comment sections when you are not here for that, but just appreciating great releases. So better to post something else and not get entire group shut down. Suddenly 20 copies tape may be more visible than 500 CD's, as the other thing... well, is not visible. But what is its "popularity" is entirely different thing.
I have mentioned to several others that one thing people tend to ignore is speed of expression. How you measure "popularity" or "visibility", of things that can be so different than one artist is doing 10-50 copies tapes, 6 times a month and "everything sells out", "everybody talks about it".. and indeed, its like 3 comments somewhere and couple flame emojis. And then, we should compare it with band who does release every 5 years, and sells 500-1000 LP/CD. No gigs. No talk. But clearly, numbers indicate there is vastly different kind of popularity there. There might be really great artist there who just made the amazing 30 copies tape... but would you fly to see him play in Osaka? Hell no. Many wouldn't even walk out of their flat even to local gig. So to measure what is popular, is interesting question. It is interesting also to see who discusses it. If its guy who wasn't there 5 years ago, he might have only seen the flood of small noise tapes, since speed how power electronics or industrial works is so much slower. Albums tend to mean more. They often have longer lifespan. In noise you may have had 5 new releases since you last talked with friend, in PE, "your new album" may be something that came 3 years ago and is really still the NEW album.
So... well, lets say great interview, cheer Tisbor & WCN! Although too bad public episode ended just as could have been some good advice! hah..
