WRONG kind of music sampled for noise?

[Cantleman]

If it works sample what ever the fuck you want... context and composition will determine is quality.

Wasn't it slayer used on Hatesville?

[k.p.g]

Funny to see a topic that started out of a discussion I was directly involved in.  As far as my own work, I can imagine what the samples people disliked on the last CD release were not so cheaply pasted in, but rather forced out of old cassettes.  The struggle to make those sounds was about the same process as creating most "noise" on any other release I make would go. 

But to speak on sampling in general, I find myself struggling to find an answer.  When does a sample stop and plunderphonics begin?  Are artists like Emil Beaulieau and John Wiggins really sampling? 

[Moran]

Samples feel WRONG when they feel lazy compositionally and thematically. Samples of 20th-century politics on recent albums can feel perfunctory. Non-exotic music samples can work if they fit the context.

[Krigsverk]

Also... things that has been used 2382 times before should be avoided. Jim Jones death tape is a good example... I wonder how many noise/industrial albums contains that speech? We should list them. I think I have heard it used creatively once, as in parts treated and integrated into the music. But just pressing play and drone over it again? Please.

[Moran]

Death Squad's Theological Genocide has it, but it's the intro, so it doesn't feel disruptive, and it fits the album's themes.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

There is entire tape comp from Sweden where every artists uses the speech, hah... Mostly it is not done in the obvious ways.

Perhaps that leads to question of sampling "wrong kind of" speeches in general. I am less annoyed by the content, more annoyed about the sound quality or something being too contemporary. Sampling current day political speeches, pretty much instant failure. Not because there would be lack of good speeches to sample from, but generally if it is sounding like you're trying to listen good noise and someone is watching the news from TV... pfff..

[John Cagefight]

Sampling current day political speeches, pretty much instant failure. Not because there would be lack of good speeches to sample from, but generally if it is sounding like you're trying to listen good noise and someone is watching the news from TV... pfff..

"Our exciting adventures and boldest endeavors have not yet begun. My fellow Americans for our movement, for our children, and for our beloved country - and I say this despite all thats happened...The best is yet to come"

[k.p.g]

more annoyed about the sound quality or something being too contemporary.

So this makes me think of thoughts I have had since 2024.  When will the time to sample modern speeches be acceptable?  5-10 years after the fact?  Are we just being fed with too many sound clips in the modern age that almost none of them make an impact like speeches of the past?  And are sound quality clips too clear in the modern age that they just cannot translate all so well onto a modern noise recording, as opposed to something with the quality of something akin to this Jim Jones tape?

[Moran]

What tends to annoy me about modern speech samples is when they're too on the nose or imply subjects that have been discussed a lot without much insight. They can date the music without detracting from it when used tastefully.

[Duncan]

Are we just being fed with too many sound clips in the modern age that almost none of them make an impact like speeches of the past?

Simplistic as it is, I'd be happy to sign off as this as pretty much the whole thing. Media has drastically changed over the last decade and a half, and noise boys might want to find some new tricks if they're genuinely invested in making a point about what they're doing. I don't care if it's packaged in a nice cassette and layered with cool sounds - I've seen the youtube video you used for that sample and so has everybody else.

Back to the original thrust of this thread, I'm currently listening to Veprisuicida- La Rivoluzione Stereosadista (off the back of your 'now playing' comments, I might add!) and some very identifiable slabs of Pantera's Fucking Hostile are evident in one particular passage. I can say that there is some pretty interesting cut up and looped usage of the material here, and of course caveats are due for the time and context of its creation, but even at the best imaginable presentation of source material, there is never going to be a time in my life I need to hear that shitty song cropping up in an otherwise perfectly serviceable and engaging experimental music.

The first thing this thread made me think about is a Con-Dom track (can't remember which, sorry) which appears to just be a very blown out, saturated run through a track off King Crimson's Red. Amused me no end when I first heard it and even with all the respect and love I have for the project (and again, the understanding I have of differences in time and place) I can't help but hear it as a mildly silly outlier in the wider context of his conceptual ideas and their fantastic execution.