Hip hop / rap

[aububs]

You don't need to care. Nobody's asking you to.

I like PE.
And I like hip hop.
And I recognise the dumb trappings of both.
Just calling out the hypocrisy of moaning about the lame aspects of hip hop when you're a rabid PE fanatic.

[Theodore]

You don't need to care. Nobody's asking you to.

People who don't like hip-hop and rap are wimps. Plain and simple.

I won't continue discussion on this subject. As i told, i don't give a shit about hip-hop. The reason i told my opinion is that nosense connection between hip-hop and PE, you [aububs] did and keep doing. If you say so ... your problem, not mine. Seems you like "lame aspects" music generally.

[Bleak Existence]

there people who do PE and like Rap like any other style of music first who come to mind from the old school is Skm-Etr, Slogun and me World Downfall when i was active still listen to chicano Rap and PE more into HNW now

[aububs]

You don't need to care. Nobody's asking you to.

People who don't like hip-hop and rap are wimps. Plain and simple.

I won't continue discussion on this subject. As i told, i don't give a shit about hip-hop. The reason i told my opinion is that nosense connection between hip-hop and PE, you [aububs] did and keep doing. If you say so ... your problem, not mine. Seems you like "lame aspects" music generally.

No need to get personal, Theodore.

[SinkSlopProcessing]

An old joke:
"Do you listen to hip hop?"
"Sure - every time I'm stopped at a traffic light"

And I think that encapsulates my issue with hip-hop: the ubiquity of it. If not in person, than in mainstream pop culture at large - you hear it absolutely everywhere, and that's been the case going on 30 years now. If I heard the kind of sonic art that we discuss here on this board as often as I heard hip-hop, I'd probably stop listening to it out of sheer exhaustion.

[Fluid Fetish]

Modern hip hop and rap is basically just like modern country, just another auto-tuned, watered down, hyper cloned genre regurgitating the same over and over that basically just mirrors all modern pop music. Notice that there isn't much of a difference any longer between how the genre's sound  essentially(modern popular rock/metal, country, rap/hiphop, and pop)?

I listen primarily to 90's gangster rap, all varities of metal, and noise with some occassional classic rock or goth rock thrown in if I HAD to narrow down my tastes, and I really don't have any problem with it. I rediscovered rap in my early twenties through old Three Six Mafia and all the solo DJ Paul and Lord Infamous stuff, which sounds ironically like a lot of it was recorded under the same conditions a lot of black metal was recorded (shitty 4 track in a basement while on a lot of speed and other drugs), then you read about how fucking crazy someone like Infamous was in real life and then the whole thing falls into place, especially why he died so young, went to prison, and so on.

This will probably get me pissed on but what I found ironic is that metal, punk, noise, rap, all of these draw from the same source in a way but are just different faces or manifestations of the same lawless energy/current. You establish yourself in all of these genre's through anti-social behavior, violent hostility towards mainstream culture, extreme aesthetics and fashion, affinity for vinyl and DIY culture, eccentric and over the top personalities etc.  

Look at the picture of Eazy-E holding up too 9mm's....and then look at the picture of Varg in his church burning days holding up his knives...they're holding the same pose...

[re:evolution]

I agree with the sentiment that modern hip hop pails in comparison to the earlier material.  This isn't down to any sort of nostalgia, but comes down to current legal issues of sample clearance and copyright control destroying the 'creativity' of the genre.

Album's like "It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back" by Public Enemy could literally not be made/ lawfully cleared with sampling legislation as it applies today. Although 18 years old now when I gave it a spin a few months back it still sounds 'vital' after all these years.  It is constructed with literally hundreds of samples, including Slayer, David Bowie and the obligatory James Brown - to name just 3.  Public Enemy were one such group that took sampling to another level and not the current trend of just relying on sampling a single hook from another song (...which itself comes down to the fact that artists pay through the nose to clear single samples).

On the other hand experimental hip hop groups like Dalek have done some very interesting murky soundscape based hip hop that is quite 'David Lynch' or 'Penderecki' in vibe.  But then again given they went on tour with post-metal outfit ISIS, clearly they are not of the typical hip hop norms.

[VelvetCurtain]

Ha!
I think I just like evil, menacing, over-the-top, tough shit. In my honest opinion, Evil Pimp's best tracks are super fucking tough.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muQybi6PMkk

[Marko-V]

Hip hop culture has that charming camp value in it (just like metal). Grown-up men behaving like 14-year-old boys.
Experimental and genre blending hip hop is completely another issue.

[VelvetCurtain]

You don't need to care. Nobody's asking you to.

People who don't like hip-hop and rap are wimps. Plain and simple.

I won't continue discussion on this subject. As i told, i don't give a shit about hip-hop. The reason i told my opinion is that nosense connection between hip-hop and PE, you [aububs] did and keep doing. If you say so ... your problem, not mine. Seems you like "lame aspects" music generally.

Bahaha!

[cutter]

LOL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5msWb1l2j6g

Actually the "new generation of hip hop" is not in my taste (grown up at oldschool groups) but i must say this is on point

[NO PART OF IT]

LOL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5msWb1l2j6g

Actually the "new generation of hip hop" is not in my taste (grown up at oldschool groups) but i must say this is on point

I can't stand videos of this nature, but the rapper does seem to make an attempt to take Outkast material into new territory, and is definitely respectable. 

[NO PART OF IT]

I'm honestly more aligned with the people who have chimed in about why they don't like hip hop/rap, as a grown up, but ultimately I grew up in an almost entirely non-white peer environment until I was 11, and didn't listen to anything but rap for most of that time.  As such, and generally speaking, I listen to rap from time to time for the same reasons that old metal heads listen to DIO or something.  It is more or less vapid material, but at times it can be clever, good to clean the apartment to, maybe lift weights, etc.   And I prefer it to techno. 

To disagree with many people here, the most tedious is the hip hop that attempts to be deep and sentimental.  I just like sharp and clever and catchy, the more arrogant and childish, the better.  I have liked elements of MF Doom, and some others whose names I can't even remember at this time, but most people fail at the idea of "new directions" by way of experimental/time signatures/spacial stuff in underground hip hop. 

I'm still keen on Outkast and Wu Tang Clan, and a smattering of other "mainstream" artists, not to mention various underground stuff, from time to time, but I have to admit that Eminem is miles above everybody to me, especially because he is not only the most talented, but also clear enough, not using "gangsta" slang so much that it is alienating. 



But I'm drawn to extremely clever combinations of syllables for effect.  The best example of this is one of his early tracks.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6VJZK6G5dQ

"I hope god forgives me for my sins
I guess it all depends
on if I keep on killin' my girlfriends"

"freestyles" and "rap battles" also interest me, because people are challenged to be insulting in a spontaneous rhyming manner completely impromptu, and this is pretty much the only arena of hip hop where I am ever truly impressed.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqV5zLqr2so


Also noteworthy to me is his capacity to piss people off unrelentingly.  This video is not particularly good, but it's the only one to insult Michael Jackson and discuss pedophilia while also Paris Hilton, who is in the video, and various other things, and it was aired on MTV, probably the best selling hip hop artist ever.  Interestingly enough, this is his last hurrah before making more serious, but still vulgar, music that is easier to sell to 11 yr olds, but it's still very talented, for what it's worth.   After this song, Michael Jackson bought all of the rights to his songs.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dcVOmEQzKA

Other than that, there are a couple of Puerto Rican strippers that I like to listen to, mainly because of the textural quality of their voices.



This one I genuinely enjoy, it's creative and energetic.  Mariah Lynn:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sCX32jBGUs



And then there's this one.  "very talented".   Cardi B:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMun3qjKAZU

[NO PART OF IT]

I am curious what the general consensus about "black music" and its origins is in Europe. 
In America, it's basically thought that black people invented music and white people stole it, and most contemporary music is based off of the blues.
I have read that there were a great deal of white indentured servants mixed with African slaves in the Caribbean, as a  sort of slave holding ground, and it was a mixing of these cultures that created sousa and other styles of music.
Do people in Europe think that pop music as it is today was based off of something that was invented by Europeans?  What is the generic history about that in Europe? 
America is only 500 years old, so I'm curious if anyone can share an educated perspective from a much older continent. 

[GEWALTMONOPOL]

When I listen to old rock n roll I hear a marriage between country and blues. I never got the "whites stole rock n roll from the blacks" argument. Everyone takes influence from everyone which allows music to evolve. Call it interpreting, borrowing, stealing or appropriating. It's never going to change. So Elvis is a thief who had no right to play rock n roll while Afrika Bambaataa's Planet Rock makes him an innovator? I call bullshit on that.

That's my opinion. I'm sure people over here are as misguided, guilt ridden and deluded in general about the origins of black music as they are over there.