Having no interest in your own scene

[calaverasgrande]

I go through long periods where I dont listen to anything at all.  Or I listen to oldies, Mexican stations or classical.
I don't like to listen to anything that is too similar to the type of music or sound I make. I have a fear that what I listen to will influence my playing and composition.
There is that one year when Born Against came out with that record, by the end of the year all the punk bands had similar parts in their songs.
I think this also comes up when folks listen to old recordings of projects they worked on. Especially when you are younger you tend to really wear your influences on your sleeve.

On the other hand, there are a lot of douchey fuckheads in every type of music scene. It is very easy to get burnt out on all of that.

[NO PART OF IT]

I do think there is a lot similar in being stuck in "local social scene" as well as being outside everything. Both of these involve strong disinterest in seeking what is GREAT FUCKING NOISE. Wasting time on some local guys out of "obligation" and not seeking what is vital, creative and powerful at this very moment (or before). Or wasting your time on creating shit, thinking fooling around with kaoz pad and generic laptop plugins makes your work somehow noteworthy. Because lacking all ability to see what is happening out there. All being focused on fact that anything is worthy because your own cluelessness.

If you follow atleast something. Not even as obsessive fanboy, you may realize why not all local acts are worth praise, or why your own stuff needs to be go further...

Agreed on this part.  Some people don't need to be obsessed with noise, but it's clear when there are other intentions. 

I think also a lot of people notice the parroting of gear, pedal chains, etc.  I once watched an industrial / noise show where all of the artists were great in their own way, but they all basically did the same set with different machines, and sometimes the machines weren't different; elektribes and various glowing orb multi effect devices, etc.  The drum machine dirge, the samples of serial killers or women crying, the same synth LFO setting, etc, the same hills and valleys.  It was still good, but it's not something to aspire to.  Some performances are masterpieces, others are ham sandwiches. 

I also think it's a matter of balance and intuition.  I don't like rules or rulebooks about things that are nebulous and on a somewhat case-by-case basis.  I pay attention to what I pay attention to, I steadfastly ignore the rest.  I think this ties into why people do noise / industrial / PE in the first place.  Some think it is about being nihilistic and not caring, or others think it is about being cynical and jaded.  More and more rarely do I feel like someone is NOT doing something to scream "me too!" and be part of a group. 

I personally am more in the realm of a somewhat modernist "truth/beauty/genius" kind of approach to making noise, I don't have a problem with it being called art, and this is because I am easily bored with people making sounds that I feel are unenthusiastic.  If you can't be ecstatic about making  a racket, you're just kind of trying to take more than you give to your audience, which is what leads to people being jaded in the first place...  Like some cyclical feed of noise performance scoffing at audience scoffing at noise... 

With that in mind, I am a part of a "scene", if I must call it that, to the extent that the scene contains people who are thrilling, or at least, are good to hang out with. 

Speaking of being jaded, I've had 3 people that couldn't wrap their heads around finishing an email interview over the last couple of years.  Did they think it was cool to do that?  I don't know...  with all of the instant access of this current world, I just think it is much easier to see if people care or not, whether they are "in the scene" for good intentions or not. 

[calaverasgrande]

I personally am more in the realm of a somewhat modernist "truth/beauty/genius" kind of approach to making noise, I don't have a problem with it being called art, and this is because I am easily bored with people making sounds that I feel are unenthusiastic.  If you can't be ecstatic about making  a racket, you're just kind of trying to take more than you give to your audience, which is what leads to people being jaded in the first place...  Like some cyclical feed of noise performance scoffing at audience scoffing at noise... 

I enthusiastically agree.
I have been to a lot of shows with almost indistinguishable acts. I don't care if it is metal, punk, noise, PE or synthwave. A bunch of indentical song structures, identical gear, even dressed alike.
I expect someone to bring a minimum of conviction. I arrived at calling it an agenda. If you do not have a reason why you are making noise, you are just being a follower. If you don't have a reason why you wrote your songs, you are just going through the motions.

[Duncan]

Lots of interesting takes here.

I'm from a small town where despite small numbers of people, there is still too much going on to keep up with.  That said, lots of it isn't to my taste and falls very much under the 'dicking about with laptop and kaos pad' umbrella and I'm pretty absent at events heavy on these performers.

In any case, I'm friendly with most people here whether or not I enjoy their music, but you can tell there are several folk who only listen to any kind of experimental music or noise when playing it or watching their friends do so.

I suppose it brings about wider questions as to what function this music has for the listener: for many, it is years of fairly solitary obsession and culture whereas for others it is a strand of their social lives.  Obviously I have my preferences and think the former produced things I'd rather hear, but I can't deny the presence and validity of the latter.

the only thing that will really fuck me off is when people get pissy about not being offered opportunities to play or collaborate when they rarely attend shows they aren't playing and have zero recorded work. As though the fact you make stuff is enough that you should be getting offers to do things rather than if it's any good!

[david lloyd jones]

re-scene.
if you are in your 50's and been to gigs for over 30years you may no longer be interested in the scene (but not me, am still happy to watch this stuff!) whilst having an awareness of what goes on.
don't know the original article referred to, but if Whitehouse, they have always taken this stance as the 'original and best' , or so my take on it is.

[tiny_tove]

regarding attachment to "local" scene.
there is no local people in my area. I only meet on regular basis with 1/2 of the Occidental Congress team, period.
In Milan there are many other people involved but there is no such thing as "scene" to support. There have been attempts, but not related to nasty noise/PE, so not my cup of tea - although people involved are really nice.

[martialgodmask]

There are of course a number of arguements for and against surrounding yourself with similar music and horizons can be narrowed as much as they can be broadened. For what it's worth, it wasn't a Whitehouse interview that I had read.

The original topic wasn't really a statement or question of whether one should be an active supporter or participant of one's local scene, but instead a musing on being an active contributor in this wider community that we find ourselves in whilst shutting out or dismissing said community and, what would draw one to make this kind of music (that is arguably not the most welcoming to all comers) if it is not a culture or artform that means anything to you.

Not sure that makes it any clearer but there you go!

[Duncan]

Well, it seems to me that the wider community is still so small and it's subcategories so interconnected that to listen to music within it is to some way take part as one is essentially immersing oneself in its culture. For this reason I don't understand any kind of stance which claims a flat out rejection of the scene.  I always felt as though listening and the community providing the sounds were very much linked. Inescapably so.

[david lloyd jones]

in many non metropolitan areas there is no scene to distance yourself from, only regional or national.
given the, worldwide, miniscule nature of this accumulation of genres, to distance yourself from all seems perverse,
but to distance from social gatherings not so.
if not Whitehouse, then still intrigued as to who.

[SinkSlopProcessing]

I think we are talking about 2 different things - or at least 2 different aspects of what one would consider a "scene". There's listening to and seeking out new music/noise. That part I've never grown tired of, and I can't imagine why anyone would want to keep making noise if you're tired of listening to it.

But when I think of a scene, I'm picturing the social aspect of it, and the live performances. Basically, anything that happens outside the studio and outside the home. I have far less interest in this for several reasons; not the least of which being I'm a hermit.

Here in the states, there seem to be a few cities that have a noise scene that waxes and wanes (Houston, Milwaukee, Portland, Seattle). But at this particular moment in time, it's all very similar: all harsh noise wall, and all themed with stocking fetish, giallo films, and porn. Nothing wrong with that, but it's awfully... specific. What are the odds of everyone in the noise scene being into that exact thing right now? Seems to me it all grew out of the handful of early artists who did this particular combination of imagery and HNW (Richard Ramirez, The Rita, etc), and everyone else copied them and formed a few cliques in some locales. Maybe there is more room for variety in these scenes, I can't say. But I just don't see it. So why even try to be a part of that if you clearly don't fit the prescribed mold?

[martialgodmask]

I think we are talking about 2 different things - or at least 2 different aspects of what one would consider a "scene". There's listening to and seeking out new music/noise. That part I've never grown tired of, and I can't imagine why anyone would want to keep making noise if you're tired of listening to it.

This was what I was driving for in the original post but probably distorted by my hamfisted way of putting it across.

[13]

Well put.

[Andrew McIntosh]

Wall Noise has always been the least imaginative and most derisive sub-genre.

[calaverasgrande]

The tendency of a lot of 'noise' acts to engage in the same esthetics is kind of inevitable.  It seems like even in an obscure subculture there is an urge to conform and belong.  I think a lot of the so called misanthropic posturing is derived from this as well.
A few early artists in noise/industrial probably were misanthropes. And a lot of acts have a fetish for sampling the voices of or cut and pasting images of people like Manson, Ramirez and so on.
Not terribly different than the metal scene in that regard.

The conformism can be kind of shocking. I remember when I saw a performance of an Oakland noise act a while ago at the long gone 40th st warehouse. The headliners had the temerity to appear on stage with an actual sampler!
All the scene snobs were so offended. How dare you bring TTET into our temple. Don't you know we only allow modulars and guitar pedals.

[GEWALTMONOPOL]

Gear snobbery is an entire thread of its own. How much contempt there can be over the use of laptops yet people think nothing of someone who just performed a set consisting of entire tracks dumped onto a SP 404.