The upcoming resurgence of the CD

[FreakAnimalFinland]

This is also matter of perspective. If label has 1 CD, that is 300 copies, and he gets like 2-20 orders per year, it seems too slow. But if there is back catalogue of 20 releases, and you get  2-20 orders for each therefore even few hundred orders for items what theoretically can be labeled "doesn't sell shit" -category, I think it's pretty good. I think that is quite realistic, thinking at first you sell 10-100 copies and rest...  will sit in storage and wait.

It's perspective one should remember. Many of the noise classics, MSNP tapes, DEADLINE tapes, GROSS tapes, PAIN JERK tapes... etc, they sold often mere 20-100 copies. Including distributors and waiting for paper flyers and catalogues to circulate.

Now people are in such an hurry, not understanding that if you make A GREAT and interesting release, it will take some time people can hear it. It just doesn't work only based on pre-order hype. There are other ways, but they may demand commitment for longer time.

We can now observe something like CONCRETE MASCARA album situation. Perennial Disappointment CD, 2016. Discogs lists 16 available, starting from 6 euro. Blossoms Of Shame CD 2014, one available, 10 euro. When this one is gone, my assumption is that it will be unavailable for a while. I don't think label made big deal that it was edition of 100. But it will soon be rather clear that it was perhaps even too small pressing.

A lot of releases I pressed on CD, are done 200 or 300. Very rarely I advertise size of pressing, be it small or big. A lot of CD's are very very low in stock now. A lot of them sold out long ago. Some have lasted nearly 10 years, but little by little, just about everything sells out. I think one thing what separates tapes and CD's, is the pace. Tapes were often treated as temporary. Tour releases, special releases, something short and quick - to make and to sell. For CD one may have to adjust into new state of mind, create things that you feel strong enough to stand for - possibly 10 years. And releases what you don't hate to see in bulk amounts in your storage boxes, hah...

[Kayandah]

Interesting points being made, as a consumer I could agree that perception wise you think CD's will be around a lot longer than cassette or vinyl, but I think that is in part the fact those 1000 print runs means cheap CDs on discogs and distro sales, so consumers think it will always be like that.

F&V is an interesting example, label was cassette only then a few LPs and the occasional CD re-issue, now it is mainly CD with LP versions on select releases. I don't know what caused the change and whether this would quality as a "resurgence"...

what I do know is that for myself and others increasing postage rates certainly affects the choice whether to buy vinyl or opt for other format. Much as I'd love to keep buying vinyl, the combined costs can often equal the price of 3 CDs

[ConcreteMascara]

I think more interesting angles to approach CD question, would be for example how big role is the mentality, where people think CD will be "always available". The price, or urgency to buy it. When you announce LP, ltd to 99, people rush to buy it. Simply because they know it won't be available for long. I think CD generally is assumed to be "always there". You buy it when you got time and opportunity, like waiting bigger order to save with shipping. When CD is now being made often 100-300 copies, just like vinyl, how it will effect? I would assume, that their availability won't be forever, like in case of early 2000's CD 1000 copies editions forever listed at discogs for 2-5usd level.

This is certainly how I think of CDs, the friend that's always in reach. For example, it's tempting to grab the latest stuff from Tesco or Galakthorrö on vinyl, and often there's a very short window to get it for a fair price, but knowing that 9 times out of 10 there will be a CD option that will remain available for years for a reasonable price gives some choice. For myself it's especially true that I'll wait to make a big order from a distro that carries a lot of CDs, and then grab releases that span a few years. Music doesn't go stale so it's nice to save on some shipping and get a big 'ol package of goodies at once. I can understand it might be a pain in the ass for distros and labels to hold on to lots of stock but I still rely on labels like Galakthorrö, Malignant, Freak Animal, Filth & Violence, Hospital, Autarkeia and Tesco to have their best titles available on CD for a long time. Why should every "essential" or even "excellent" release go OOP and demand insane prices on Discogs and the like?

But I can also agree with the below generally:

Another case for declining CD sales would be sheer volume. If noise CD sold 500 to 1000 in 1995, just think how many CD's people had in their shelves back then? Fast forward decades, and people may simply have so much of stuff, that releases selling less is not matter of format or even pricing, but simply question how much stuff one would need? So instead of buying 100+ CD's a year, you buy... 1-10? I can totally understand the guy who has thousands of releases he didn't listen for years, even if he wanted, that thinking "no thanks" is better option than buying more. Answer would be only to reach new blood, or release something unique enough, in edition that is realistic. Not just like.... another lazy M.B. collaboration?

Personally, I experience this fatigue with all formats. my record collection just recently surpassed my CD collection, which started about 5 years before my LP collection. But more and more I find myself asking, do I really need another CD/tape/LP? And if I do, what media do I have the most space for? now I've got all of these LPs and a constantly shrinking storage space. Frankly I'd rather pick up more CDs or tapes again...

And then my brain will tell me I need everything and I'm missing out on so much essential music and a few $100s later I've got stacks of new music to listen to and no time to do it. And on top of that there's an ever growing list of "essential" or "classic" music I've still never picked up, but also an endless stream of new music that deserves attention... and I'll end there before I derail this thread.

[Cementimental]

The upcoming resurgence of the CD

I look forward to it, along with desktop Linux and bitcoin becoming the world currency :D

[Zeno Marx]

I've always liked CDs a lot.  Never cared for the fact that they manufacture them out of one of the least scratch-resistant plastics known to man, or that they succumb to disc rot and oxidation more quickly than even cassettes.  I'd like to see those vices remedied.  I still buy CDs, but I hesitate to buy used CDs without seeing them in person.  I don't watch the market, so it is nice to hear they might be gaining traction again.  I guess when push comes to shove, they're a stupid, antiquated format when I think of how friendly bandcamp is, but they're less stupid than cassettes and vinyl. Even if in a jewel case, how much does it cost to ship one across the world vs. an LP?  I'm into the resurgence of CDs as the best physical option.  A market going smart?  Say it ain't so.

[ConcreteMascara]

Even if in a jewel case, how much does it cost to ship one across the world vs. an LP?  I'm into the resurgence of CDs as the best physical option.  A market going smart?  Say it ain't so.

Often surprisingly close in cost in my latest experience... at least 1 CD vs 1 LP

[bitewerksMTB]

Cd is around $14.50 & Lp is around $23. With cd, even if you remove jewel case, it's still $14 as that's the minimum rate. I was told by a postal clerk that if I tried cd/sleeve in an envelope meant for photos then the cost would be lower, maybe.

[Zeno Marx]

$14 as that's the minimum rate

mind.  blown.  (I haven't mailed internationally in a while)

[FreakAnimalFinland]

I got letter with two 7"s. It was 23$. One 10" was it 25$...
unlikely i'd pay that and feel sorry even to trade when knowing What someone has to pay. Cheaper for him to order than trade...

[bitewerksMTB]

Goddamn. I would have thought two 7"'s would be $14.00. Maybe in a padded envelope w/one piece of cardboard. 8 ounces would be $14 but 10 oz would be $23.50 (just checked the USPS International price calculator). Go over 8 ounces & price goes from $14 to $23.50, nothing in between.

[david lloyd jones]

Whatever the format etc,what kills is the international postage which has stopped my purchasing.
Decent distro prices ( on whole)seem to mean some kind of hit by distros

[ConcreteMascara]

Cd is around $14.50 & Lp is around $23. With cd, even if you remove jewel case, it's still $14 as that's the minimum rate. I was told by a postal clerk that if I tried cd/sleeve in an envelope meant for photos then the cost would be lower, maybe.

From my perspective, if I'm already paying $14.50 might as well pay the $23 for the LP, if it's the preferred format for a particular release.

But there really isn't a distro or label I order from in industrial or otherwise that doesn't eat some postage costs when shipping out orders. I buy a lot of techno 12"s, and on the plus side, shipping from Germany seems to have gone down in the past year and I'm able to get a lot of records for really reasonable shipping prices.

[holy ghost]

I bought records and tapes in the 90's, but by the early 2000's my musical tastes had shifted a lot and I bought CDs heavily throughout the 2000's. It was way easier to track down Yeti by Amon Duul II or Interstellar Space by John Coltrane than finding an original LP, so I had this collection of hardcore punk, early classic rock and metal on LP but most jazz, krautrock, noise, prog on CD because it was just more economical, CDs were cheaper, postage was easier, even NWN was selling CDs for $5 each! I never stopped buying vinyl but I didn't have that "ONLY ANALOG IS REAL" mentality (ridiculous anyway but whatever). But at that point in my life I was listening to so much variety I simply wasn't willing to spend $60 on a copy of For Alto or First Utterance when the reissue is $12.99.

But in the last 10 years it's become easier to buy reissues on LP, and seemingly easier to track down records I want due to discogs (and perhaps people realizing their collections are now worth something and more used vinyl seems to be prevalent), etc and I rarely buy CDs any more. The storage of them is the worst, I have so many records my CDs have been reduced to a bunch of plastic tubs in my basement.

Now I've gone full nutbar and I'm now buying LP reissues of stuff I bought 15 years ago on CD, or willing to shell out the cash for a real holy grail pressing of some stuff. It's ridiculous. I will buy noise CDs that don't have another format, but not much else these days.

Frankly I'm just glad I picked up stuff when I did because now it seems like CD prices are on the rise and good luck finding a LP copy of Meddle by Pink Floyd in a shop for less than $40 these days. It would suck to be building a core collection right now.

[jesusfaggotchrist]

I still buy CDs when I can I hate how American hipsters now think its "all about the quality of sound, maaaaan" fuck off

[holy ghost]

Just picked up that great Oxen 2xCD "Scalding Feast" - definitely makes a useful format for 160 minutes of harshness that would be impossible to do reasonably as "a vinyls". I purchased a bunch of CDs this year and it's quite nice on the wallet.