Mix: Anti–Power Electronics

[xdementia]

I think this was something talked about in recent White Centipede Noise prodcast. Capers talking how we have had enough of "c-20's" and now would be time for real albums. And was it the Heat Signature guys not being overly enthusiastic about the "bandcamp scene". And Phage kind of the same conclusions.

Of course Phage released the artist featured on the anti-power electronics page CBN... on Bandcamp no less.... https://phagetapes.bandcamp.com/album/crimes-against-white-america and it's about a 20 minute release

[psychotropicdecision]

This. Is. AWESOME!!!

[Soloman Tump]

I listened to this mix without paying any attention to the track listing.

It was a fine way to spend 43:41.

I've got a couple of Straight Panic tapes - great stuff

[KillToForget]

Yeah it seems like this is just one guy's playlist and isn't really indicative of the artists' views. Straight Panic is excellent, and I've really been liking the new CBN.

[brutalist_tapes]

i have a hard time understanding the impulse to create in a genre you supposedly hate. like doing harsh noise while hating merzbow and the incapacitants or something. i can understand people not wanting anything to do with actual national socialist/fascist music, (i'm personally not into politics in general, but will listen to both left and right bands/projects) but whitehouse, really? whitehouse and their ilk actually always seemed to me to be leftist, in that nihilistic, 20th century fin de siècle sense, when it was still all about deconstruction and transgression. at the same time, i don't have anything against this iconoclastic approach per se, kind of like how straight edge hardcore broke away from punk hedonism - or black metal rejecting the "fun" approach of death metal. it still puzzles me, though, because the ideology they have seems so mismatched with the aggression and nihilism of PE. there already is a genre that is extremely abrasive but can be more light-hearted and life-affirming: harsh noise. it's for the same reason i can't understand stuff like krishnacore, it doesn't seem very hindu/buddhist to me to get on a stage and scream and act all tough, but what do i know. in the end people can do what they want, and i'd be much happier to see friction and disagreement than people just discarding the other side completely. because they are not just saying no to fascism as far as i understand it, because at the end of the day, the attitude and music of whitehouse is not fascist, just insensitive i guess.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

just insensitive i guess.

Little moderation was done on topic.
I assumed, that people will react on one message. Despite assuming so, I thought why not test if people are grown ups enough to just move on and not react as poster most likely expects. Not a chance, haha. We live in reality. If reality is there may be unknown number of boneheaded people on board, we certainly know there are people who can't handle it without putting focus on it.

Anyone can check forum behavior guide and continue here on topic if there seems to be things worth to discuss.

[brutalist_tapes]

to me it seems like total revisionism to call bennett a racist because of that project. he may be a "boomer" or whatever, but as far as i know, that kind of "cultural appropriation" was actually a quite progressive practice in his hey day, identifying with "the other" and what not. is robert crumb also a racist? i guess you could say so. every artist who has "appropriated" the "primitive" is apparently a fascist now, all the european modernists included i guess. maybe you can't call whitehouse leftist by todays standard, but isn't their name a mockery of some right wing prude from the 80s? times change, and it seems that the cultural environment that power electronics emerged in no longer exist. now you have to be earnest and forthcoming, no more irony, no more detournement, and so on. but it used to be a practice! as i see it, genuine right wing power electronics is a recent phenomenon.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

I think it depends what you call "recent"?
By early 90's, that's about 30 years ago, was bands who were not ironic, nor merely attempting to be shocking. As one example, Control Resistance. I don't think it was seen to be at the time, somehow remarkably offensive or something you should protest against.
It was one side of industrial-noise / power electronics, even if not genre defining element. One doesn't have to take it as baggage, but this element is facturally there. For anyone to see and check out.

Whitehouse and Bennet has made his point clear so many times, that I don't see need to clear his name, nor blame him for anything.

I am often puzzled how SI as a forum, would be seen as primarily favorable for... racism/fascism? It makes me think as if people who make this claim, may not be as clever and intelligent as they claim. It is possible to see beyond obvious. It is possible to feed the creative. Luckily not so much on SI, but elsewhere I see that when there would be option to do whatever creative thing and dialogue, things are awfully quiet, until there is possibility to voice concern on disapproved persons or some random who-the-fuck-cares bozo making one lazy remark. I think world needs zero anti-power electronics, it needs more power and resilience.

[W.K.]

@brutalist_tapes

Are you replying to me? Because you are not quoting me? I never said Benett is a racist, I don't think so, but it's easy to make an argument for it looking at some of his work. Is Robert Crumb racist? No, but some his comics definitely are. Is Mark Solotroff a racist? No, but AWB Recordings definitely tried to be. Is it irony? Sure. Is it an artistic decision? Totally. Does art not need the freedom to operate in the space between grey areas, ask questions and critique the leading order and morality? Yes. That also means someone else could see it as racist and it could totally be true if in his/her opinion if there isn't a clear explanation, background is important, context is still important, even if it's meant as an ironic statement (which often is a cheap excuse and usually more a matter of 'how can I be most extreme? Nazi symbols!', and it definitely works).  

Racism is not a always black/white discussion most people on all fronts want it to be, yet everyone want to have their opinion to be the 'rightest' rather listen to what actually is going on and what the real problems are. Anyway I've said enough. I don't now a single PE guy that maimed someone yet more than 6000 migrants died doing cheap labor in Qatar building stadiums for the world football cup that only will be used once. Yet racist PE is a problem. Makes sense! On with the music.

Straight Panic is a cool project, liked his Apocalypse album quite a lot. Not a fan of the label it released on though, selling $8 albums as CDs while they are clearly CDRs, thought we where over that shit by 2008 already.

[brutalist_tapes]

@brutalist_tapes

Are you replying to me? Because you are not quoting me? I never said Benett is a racist, I don't think so, but it's easy to make an argument for it looking at some of his work. Is Robert Crumb racist? No, but some his comics definitely are. Is Mark Solotroff a racist? No, but AWB Recordings definitely tried to be. Is it irony? Sure. Is it an artistic decision? Totally. Does art not need the freedom to operate in the space between grey areas, ask questions and critique the leading order and morality? Yes. That also means someone else could see it as racist and it could totally be true if in his/her opinion if there isn't a clear explanation, background is important, context is still important, even if it's meant as an ironic statement (which often is a cheap excuse and usually more a matter of 'how can I be most extreme? Nazi symbols!', and it definitely works).  

Racism is not a always black/white discussion most people on all fronts want it to be, yet everyone want to have their opinion to be the 'rightest' rather listen to what actually is going on and what the real problems are. Anyway I've said enough. I don't now a single PE guy that maimed someone yet more than 6000 migrants died doing cheap labor in Qatar building stadiums for the world football cup that only will be used once. Yet racist PE is a problem. On with the music.

Straight Panic is a cool project, liked his Apocalypse album quite a lot. Not a fan of the label it released on though, selling $8 albums as CDs while they are clearly CDRs, thought we where over that shit by 2008 already.

yeah sorry, i'm used to other forums, didn't see the quote button! i totally get what you are saying, and i don't necessarily have an opinion how the definition of racism has shifted, i just remember when it was clearly understood that people like crumb, solotroff and bennett were pushing limits regarding the view on racism, power, oppression and so on. i think that this idea that the recipient is the one who decides the works intent is a new one, and partly comes from post-modern theorizing, but i could be wrong. you could say that the time for those kinds of provokation are over, and i would kind of aggree. but for me it doesn't make it racist if some guy tried to tackle some controversial topics, in a maybe a little bit clumsy way, in the everything-goes underground culture of the last millenium. maybe off-topic, but do anyone know if the reception on for example the marquis de sade has shifted? when i went to university his work was viewed as a kind of left-field (if not leftist) transgression, deconstruction of the libertine culture prevalent in the society before the revolution and so on. i guess now most people view him as a fascist? but as i said, haven't followed these things in a while. was just surprised to see the rage against whitehouse. stuff like zyklon ss (i like the project a lot) can be expected, though.

[brutalist_tapes]

I think it depends what you call "recent"?
By early 90's, that's about 30 years ago, was bands who were not ironic, nor merely attempting to be shocking. As one example, Control Resistance. I don't think it was seen to be at the time, somehow remarkably offensive or something you should protest against.
It was one side of industrial-noise / power electronics, even if not genre defining element. One doesn't have to take it as baggage, but this element is facturally there. For anyone to see and check out.

Whitehouse and Bennet has made his point clear so many times, that I don't see need to clear his name, nor blame him for anything.

I am often puzzled how SI as a forum, would be seen as primarily favorable for... racism/fascism? It makes me think as if people who make this claim, may not be as clever and intelligent as they claim. It is possible to see beyond obvious. It is possible to feed the creative. Luckily not so much on SI, but elsewhere I see that when there would be option to do whatever creative thing and dialogue, things are awfully quiet, until there is possibility to voice concern on disapproved persons or some random who-the-fuck-cares bozo making one lazy remark. I think world needs zero anti-power electronics, it needs more power and resilience.

you have a lot more knowledge on the culture than i do, but maybe it kind of went under the radar due to transgression seeming to be de rigeur in the underground of 80s/90s? thats what i'm trying to get through, seems like the culture has changed a lot, and i only started in the 00's, but still it seems obvious to me. kind of like former leftist nihilists have bad conscience for having participated in all of this and now feel a new to support the new, more puritan culture? but as i said, just me thinking loudly. it seems like a lot of people have abandoned "dangerous ideas" because of unforeseen consequences and change in culture that means they are no more artistic darlings, but evil fascists... but yeah, i don't know!

[Soloman Tump]

maybe you can't call whitehouse leftist by todays standard, but isn't their name a mockery of some right wing prude from the 80s?

She began activism in the 60s, apparently....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Whitehouse

[burdizzo1]

Yeah, but there was also a relatively extreme prono mag. around at the time called Whitehouse. Apparently. So, I suppose it seemed to work well on a couple of different levels!

[jesuspenis]

Yeah, but there was also a relatively extreme prono mag. around at the time called Whitehouse. Apparently. So, I suppose it seemed to work well on a couple of different levels!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitehouse_(magazine)

[Zeno Marx]

i think that this idea that the recipient is the one who decides the works intent is a new one, and partly comes from post-modern theorizing, but i could be wrong. you could say that the time for those kinds of provokation are over, and i would kind of aggree.

I have a sense that this was always the case, but now there is some safety, and impetus, to voice those opinions.  People were thinking these things and just not saying them.  Maybe that's what you're saying, though.  The demand to be heard is greater than ever, or so it seems.  Possibly part of the social media phenomenon?  Safety can never be underestimated, and as we can see, it's coming from both, or all, directions.  Voices get more confident and louder when they feel safe enough to express them.