What are you reading

[Duncan]

Why is that an odd move to make?

[Atrophist]

While I obviously cannot speak for anyone else, young Finnish female writers are for the most part intolerable: entitled, narcissistic, obsessed with sex and body image. These are some of the most pampered, overprivileged human beings to ever inhabit the planet, yet they insist on turning their works into litanies of victimhood.

This a generalisation, of course, and there are exceptions. Imo the most notable is the amazing Maarit Verronen. Not that she is especially young anymore.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

Yes, this is the thing. When in current moment, the "fresh" and "thoughtful" is pretty much synonym for extreme conformism of current ideals. Take small country, it's even smaller cultural cliques, and if you want to be in and involved... Get publishing contract and slice of publicity. It can not happen unless conformity is on such a unhealthy level one is suitable for contemporary publishing industry.

That said, there was campaigns trying to guilt male readers, putting some sort of online challenges about "you absolutely have to read books of female authors"... and I thought, well, I have not been challenged, but I have. Bought new books, from actual store. Read reviews from literature journals, to pick up things that seem relatively interesting.

Some stuff I privately recommended to many friends, to get - buy or try to loan from library. Some appreciated the advice greatly, so maybe some are actually worth to write in public.

[Duncan]

A lot of these criticisms make very little sense when they end with sentiments like 'but then I actually read some of this work and it was among the best I've read in years and I recommended it to my friends'. It sounds to me precisely why the discourse suggesting people ought to seek out work from different groups exists.

[Soloman Tump]

I have a lot of reading to catch up on....

England's Hidden Reverse and Kraftwerk Publikation, both gifted to me by a friend.

Noise Receptor Journal 1 recently received which I havn't started yet.

A few new zines including Black Dog Zine Issue 1 and Rituals and Declarations Issue 3.  Plenty of interesting folk lore / horror / historical zines coming out lately, and mostly high "book" quality with some decent levels of research included.

[AnonMessAgeSage]

While I obviously cannot speak for anyone else, young Finnish female writers are for the most part intolerable: entitled, narcissistic, obsessed with sex and body image. These are some of the most pampered, overprivileged human beings to ever inhabit the planet, yet they insist on turning their works into litanies of victimhood.

This a generalisation, of course, and there are exceptions. Imo the most notable is the amazing Maarit Verronen. Not that she is especially young anymore.

I have zero knowledge or care for female writers, but I hate that argument about victimhood. I hate victim culture, but that's not what I'm talking about.

It becomes a polarizing cop-out from actually answering the question, by attempting to move the goal post. In truth, all of these social identities and barriers put up are pure mirage. A king would look down on all peasants, condescendingly.
It matters not, what your politics or whatever else are, say national identity or whatever else.

These are all bogus and bullshit categories foisted-on people to keep people from wanting MORE.
And people get trapped in these dumb categories, and that becomes their own mental enslavement from desiring or wanting MORE.

And there's nothing wrong with wanting free or more from a world that is fundamentally cruel or erred at its core. It's actually the most sensible and honest thing to do.

And I probably agree with the point you're trying to make. But imagine being a poor peasant working a dirt-poor farm, and someone beneath you says, "What's the problem? You're so privileged, look at all that wonderful privilege you have." They may have food and clothes and better-off than those around them, but they're basically suggested to not ask deeper questions and clamor for more. And social media works mainly the same way. In reality, that's all they know. They were never TOLD that life could be more. That's my point.

You can't say "this" or "that", of course you can, but you'll effectively get banned. Because that's an effective way to control a narrative.

And if you don't care about that, then great. And I don't.

But I digress.

But of course I agree with the point you're getting at. My commentary wasn't in a socio-political sense, just in terms of linguistics and logic.

As for female writers, I only like Ayn Rand, because she kind of indirectly created Anton LaVey, who kind of indirectly inspired Noise, through Boyd Rice.

But I'm sure other female writers out there are ok.

[Atrophist]

I'm not really talking about female authors as such. I mean a fairly small subset of female authors, ones that come recommended by trendy leftists literature journals, or critics in mainstream newspapers. Their formula is, as was mentioned above, "transgression" that is actually completely safe and predictable. And yes, I actually have given more than a few of these a try. The result is almost always an embarrassing mess. The publishing industry is actually, imo, exploiting these women by heaping praise on them too early, which leaves them in a state of arrested development. And next year a new 'fresh, courageous female voice" will emerge. Also I bet it won't be enough anymore just to be a woman, at least not much longer. You'll have be a transgender Romani dwarf, or something.

Regarding female writers in general, they have a few advantages over men, imo. When it comes to understanding interpersonal relationships and people's motivations for behaving the way they so, the average man will always lose 0-6 to the average woman.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

A lot of these criticisms make very little sense when they end with sentiments like 'but then I actually read some of this work and it was among the best I've read in years and I recommended it to my friends'. It sounds to me precisely why the discourse suggesting people ought to seek out work from different groups exists.

Context of the campaign / suggestion was this: Over here, it appears that the normal man does not read books really. And only times when they do, it is the best selling book of some sort of manly adventure. Usually from of the top selling male author who will have book out strategically for christmas or father's day. Haha. Some people are upset, that it goes like this, and think that such men should start to read more female authors instead. I tend to think.. why? It would seem better to be concerned that people do not read books at all or the category of reading is merely entertainment.  People who actually read bookS, probably have always read books by female authors.

My choice was based on content, not on gender (although gender most certainly has effect on the content). And this content is what made them good. I would rather see some other category promoted in context of literature, than gender or race. Like suggesting one can read also other things than nordic detective stories. If one has ultimately goal of somehow promote idea of books that enlighten and give new perspectives, it doesn't need to be by "woman". Just some book with actual substance. When the notion of "woman author" is the only substance, then you can expect things to turn lame.



One completely different topic in recent reading was to discover local poet. I was walking in the forest, on remote paths, but still "near the city" so to say, there was found plastic bag, with "finder can keep" text written on black marker. Inside the bag, there was poetry book by local author. Properly published, professional book. Author had signed greetings to the finder. While walking around that area of city, I found also 2nd copy of book that was dropped to be found. I'm sure there was more, but just scattered around to be found.
Book was not anything that amazing. Just contemporary poetry book. Male author. Few decent pieces, but generally I was not impressed by the content of book, but I was impressed by the sort of guerrilla tactics of distribution!

One Finnish author once concluded that what is this Black Metal garbage trying to say it is "underground". They are in festivals, on tv, selling endless amount of albums and merch, in stores and mailorders and being streamed everywhere. It is popular culture. If you want to see underground, check out Finnish poetry!

And that is of course true in some ways. In one hand, there are countless people who have no idea of "black metal" even exists, but everybody knows that poetry exists. However, in terms of could you get readers for your stuff, or would anyone pay you for the poetry book...  This argument about poetry being total underground becomes true. Yet being in total underground, may be just fine. Still endless possibilities even if you don't get into "TV" or "festivals".

[host body]

As for female writers, I only like Ayn Rand, because she kind of indirectly created Anton LaVey, who kind of indirectly inspired Noise, through Boyd Rice.

You should probably read more.

I downloaded a bunch of comic books on my tablet, to read while commuting. It's the best thing ever, I can get like a dozen comics with me. Pretty much has made me stop buying comics, so maybe not the best thing ever.

[AnonMessAgeSage]

As for female writers, I only like Ayn Rand, because she kind of indirectly created Anton LaVey, who kind of indirectly inspired Noise, through Boyd Rice.

You should probably read more.

I downloaded a bunch of comic books on my tablet, to read while commuting. It's the best thing ever, I can get like a dozen comics with me. Pretty much has made me stop buying comics, so maybe not the best thing ever.

I would, if one stood out to me.

My reading habits have changed over the years.
I don't really read books these days, unless it's truly unique.
I mostly just devour entire Wikipedia pages in an encyclopedic fashion if I want to learn about a particular topic.

[Atrophist]

I asked for recommendations for scifi/space opera earlier in this thread. Now I've found pretty much exactly what I was looking for: Adrian Tchaikovsky's Children of Time.

According to reviews this is supposed to belong to a subgenre called biopunk, but there's nothing radically new here that, for example, David Brin, Vernor Vinge or Alaistair Reynolds haven't already done. (In fact the narrative contains a not so subtle nod towards Brin).

In the distant future, a terraforning project goes terribly wrong: two shuttles are supposed to land on an Earth-like exoplanet, one full of primates, the other full of lesser Earth flora and fauna. They also carry a nanovirus that is supposed to speed up evolution on the new planet. Well, monkey shuttle gets damaged, burns up in the atmosphere. The nanovirus begins work on spiders, ants and beetles instead.

Thousands or years later, another ship with the last remaining survivors of a destroyed Earth show up. What will the evolved descendants of apes and the evolved deacendants of spiders make of each other?

A funny detail is the spiders' society's version of feminism, or "male spiders rights" movement. Which is a little more serious than the primate equivalent. Because after all, as hard as life may have been for women in the past, at least it was never considered standard procedure to kill and eat them after mating ...    

[host body]

I don't really read books these days, unless it's truly unique.
I mostly just devour entire Wikipedia pages in an encyclopedic fashion if I want to learn about a particular topic.

Honestly what do you think you can bring to a discussion about books, then? Did you read the wikipedia page for "literature"?

I can recommend the following authors to get acquainted with "female literature" (I personally don't think gender has anything to do with whether an author is good): Flannery O'Connors novellas, Margaret Atwood's Oryx & Crake, a great, nihilistic cyberpunk book or Cosey Fanni Tutti's biography. That should get you started and maybe realise that women aren't really that different from men as far as writing books go.

[AnonMessAgeSage]

I don't really read books these days, unless it's truly unique.
I mostly just devour entire Wikipedia pages in an encyclopedic fashion if I want to learn about a particular topic.

Honestly what do you think you can bring to a discussion about books, then? Did you read the wikipedia page for "literature"?

I can recommend the following authors to get acquainted with "female literature" (I personally don't think gender has anything to do with whether an author is good): Flannery O'Connors novellas, Margaret Atwood's Oryx & Crake, a great, nihilistic cyberpunk book or Cosey Fanni Tutti's biography. That should get you started and maybe realise that women aren't really that different from men as far as writing books go.

Respond with a better attitude if you want a better response. Not with a stupid baity response.
Subject is READING.
Get a more interesting life if you are personally motivated by personal one-ups on a web forum based-in Finland.
LMAO.
And Idgaf, but women and men are different. Sorry, but you very rarely will ever encounter a female Leonardo da Vinci in the human species.
Fact.

For what's it's worth, I've probably read more books than you, not it means anything. I said, that unless a book is truly unique, and I'm talking some Georges Bataille shit, or Antonin Artaud, or even my favorite blue-blooded maniac, Le Marquis De Sade, then I won't personally bother reading anything less than stellar. ESPECIALLY if it's some dumb incentive to personally participate in the cultural milieu of our times.

I am not, right nor left. I have no interest in those things.
I am a breed unto myself, who has had the grave displeasure of being born into a regular society, with regular 'folk.'
My lineage is nothing at all similar to the pedigree of the common man, but I am more or less an unwilling participant in the common man's society.

And I try very, very hard for that NOT to be the case.

I'm not gonna read something just to
challenge my reptile brain notions of what is 'proper,' literature.
I quite like my reptile brain.

And I hope to fucking GOD a reptile cavernous species comes out of the Earth to feast on this badstardized species known as humanity.

[AnonMessAgeSage]

I asked for recommendations for scifi/space opera earlier in this thread. Now I've found pretty much exactly what I was looking for: Adrian Tchaikovsky's Children of Time.

According to reviews this is supposed to belong to a subgenre called biopunk, but there's nothing radically new here that, for example, David Brin, Vernor Vinge or Alaistair Reynolds haven't already done. (In fact the narrative contains a not so subtle nod towards Brin).

In the distant future, a terraforning project goes terribly wrong: two shuttles are supposed to land on an Earth-like exoplanet, one full of primates, the other full of lesser Earth flora and fauna. They also carry a nanovirus that is supposed to speed up evolution on the new planet. Well, monkey shuttle gets damaged, burns up in the atmosphere. The nanovirus begins work on spiders, ants and beetles instead.

Thousands or years later, another ship with the last remaining survivors of a destroyed Earth show up. What will the evolved descendants of apes and the evolved deacendants of spiders make of each other?

A funny detail is the spiders' society's version of feminism, or "male spiders rights" movement. Which is a little more serious than the primate equivalent. Because after all, as hard as life may have been for women in the past, at least it was never considered standard procedure to kill and eat them after mating ...    

That last part is a fascinating idea. Black widows are definitely feminists. Female hyenas too.
Humans are impossibly stupid and self-centered, they are merely just one speck in evolution and cosmology.
There is nothing unique to humans, that isn't also seen in other animals.

Bonnobos are also a pacifist hippie species of ape.

[JLIAT]

Humans are impossibly stupid and self-centered, they are merely just one speck in evolution and cosmology.
There is nothing unique to humans, that isn't also seen in other animals.

Hmmmm.. evolution... well i guess animals use tools and language...and you could argue Mars landers and the LHC are 'merely' tools but its been said that evolution by natural selection is no longer appropriate to humans... your own criticism in part shows the survival of no longer the fittest in your opinion.  I guess war is also a fairly human trait. I'm also not sure if other animals genetically modify plants and animals for their use? I'm think of wheat... et al.

As for wikipedia, its not always a reliable source, but what i've found a benefit of recent technology is print on demand such that you can get texts which are out of print or of a niche nature by the likes of Amazon.

And to be picky, there is a line of thought that goes without humans there wouldn't be (a theory) of evolution or cosmology.