WHITE CENTIPEDE NOISE PODCAST

[WCN]

OUT NOW - Steve Underwood of Harbinger Sound on WCN Podcast !!! https://youtu.be/AVNfx2AzmBI

Steve Underwood is an international legend in underground music. He ran the eclectic UK based label Harbinger Sound, managed numerous bands, and was responsible for some unforgettable live events. He now resides in the town of Hastings, where he runs a record shop called Pressing Matters Records, and continues his involvement in the culture. He joined me at WCN HQ for an in person interview, which we continued on at his hotel during his visit to Cologne.

In the Patreon exclusive extended segments of this interview, Steve talks about the pros and cons of working with a major record distributor, the Sleaford Mods records, social media, and bootlegs, as well as his top 5 noise and experimental records of all time.

You can see all of that and much more at https://www.patreon.com/whitecentipedenoise

Thank you for your support.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

In the Love interview, one thing that really resonated with me and I think about often, is going back and spending more time with older releases. Love says, "We all could reverse a bit, we should talk about stuff that's a few years old too. It's an artifact that you can use and listen to for quite some time."

I've been more consciously trying to listen to all new releases at least a few times before it goes on the shelf and spend time revisiting releases from even the year prior. The flow of new material is just so overwhelming, it feels like new releases are so quickly pushed to the wayside and never discussed again, even just a couple of months after release. One of the negatives of this currently flourishing productivity of the last few years. There is so much material, a lot of quality material, and it's extremely difficult to keep up with it all, actually spend time and absorb the material, and enjoy it over a length of time.

I think recently in the reviews thread, there have been quite a few posts about older releases which is refreshing. Would love to see more of this! What have we all put back on the shelf from the last few years too quickly and without discussing or spending enough time with?

I think there used to be some complaints formerly, why people always talking about OLD STUFF. Almost like it would be routine to ignore everybody new, all new interesting things, just talk about MB and Merzbow and then 10 years later everybody would talk how underrated that one noise artists was. Yeah, because everybody too busy talking of things we know, instead of things happening right now.

Still now, I think it is likely that problem is not lack of focus and talk about classics, but lack of discussion, critical evaluation and writing about noise in general. I know that I could do more. I only write about fraction of stuff I listen to. Generally noticing that I got half meter pile of noise CD's and tapes that is ready to be carried home and put into collection/shelves. Only couple % of stuff gets commented. Usually more time to comment things when sitting home, pulling out some old releases from shelves and just listening and appreciating them.

I think, at least for me, many good noise releases have a story behind them. Of course appreciate the sound itself, packaging, but there is also vastly bigger experience around some releases. This is big contrast compared to "just another good noise tape", which can be very good, but may not be irreplaceable part of personal noise history.

What Ochu says about the current flood of noise, and what people tend to say about the peak of covid noise, is a bit odd for me. Covid had barely impact on anything in my life. And flood of noise has been massive in many moments of history. Like thinking something like mid 90's. You check 93, 94, 96, 97... and so on and it feels like damn! Seems like Bloodlust, RRR/Pure, Slaughter, GROSS, Deadline, and so on, put out more stuff than labels do now. Thinking stuff like Pain Jerk as one example. 93-99 and he'd put out... about 80 Pain Jerk releases. I don't really know how many relevant noise artists these days churn out releases like that? It feels that now that someone makes 3 releases a year, people start to criticize that it's too many.

I suppose there is also changing nature of releases. When the way how stuff is released, marketed and sold, is kind of "Get it! now or never!", it is not like situation with hundred Whitehouse live action tapes you can either buy, buy later, or not buy at all, and Susan Lawly would never be like "MANDATORY MUST HAVE TAPE LIMITED TO".. A lot of stuff would be like that. RRR tapes, Open Wound, Zero Cabal, Nihilistic, Con-Dom, Sound of Pig, ... etc. It wouldn't matter if they have huge amount of things, when atmosphere around the publishing it, doesn't have atmosphere of production line of manufacturing disposable items?

My own experience when specific "flood of stuff" end, however, is barely ever been "great finally its over!". Instead, almost always I find myself missing that feeling. And thinking how great would be dozen more PURE/RRR cd's? How great to receive letter with handful of biz-card cdr's from Pac Rec? How great when F&V regurgitated out bunch of vile new tapes? etc etc..   Just like my feeling with Pain Jerk is not that he did way too much stuff and I don't have time for it.

I think former WCN podcast VOMIR interview had that good moment where he was being asked why this amount of limited tapes of pretty much same sound. He mentioned that it was never intended that some guy buys them all. Most tapes were tiny edition, and circulated to handful of guys in that part of scene. Next tape circulating to other part of scene/world. From standpoint of conventional music, emphasis is on making one good album and selling the same thing everywhere. With noise, it doesn't have to be like that. You can approach it like painting or collage art. Like how ridiculous would be demand for painter that stop painting these landscapes, I have seen that already and these others look pretty much the same and I can't buy all the same looking paintings of yours. Artists may ask why you'd be buying all my paintings? You can take a look if you want, but it's not for you to buy it all and own it all. This type of realization may suddenly set you free from the music album mentality. You got guys who just want the album, then there's the maniacs who'll collect every live bootleg, every rehearsal tape, every new special bonus track edition they can hunt down. Both approaches may be fine. Perhaps the latter ones can tell to the public which items are the very best of the best. Rest are for maniacs only.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

OUT NOW - Steve Underwood of Harbinger Sound on WCN Podcast !!! https://youtu.be/AVNfx2AzmBI

Steve Underwood is an international legend in underground music. He ran the eclectic UK based label Harbinger Sound, managed numerous bands, and was responsible for some unforgettable live events. He now resides in the town of Hastings, where he runs a record shop called Pressing Matters Records, and continues his involvement in the culture. He joined me at WCN HQ for an in person interview, which we continued on at his hotel during his visit to Cologne.

Good interview. Also good reminder how the brits are most difficult to keep track what they are saying, hah... Lots of good stuff in it. It feels that the importance of the noise gig organizer of that time isn't maybe clear. So much of gigs happened at certain moment and just about everybody from USA and bunch of European countries would have stories of Steve driving them around, sleepless and seemingly "uninterested".

He did accept Grunt in a lot of shows those years. Even fests and some touring too. Usually it was funny, that things like the looong Yankee Know How tour, it was just Grunt appearing like parasite on tour, playing when and if there would be time left to do so. Often not mentioned in gig ads, but just... playing if there was time. Often Americans would sleep in hotel rooms, and then Steve and myself in some filth infested punk commune, in bean bags in room with no lights. Nice, of course.
UK visits been often like that. At most memorable visits, instead of even someones floor, sleeping with homeless dudes at concrete hole under stairs somewhere in London etc, covered in newspapers to warm up...

I think latest Harbinger lathe being re-released is on Skuggsidan's side label Analogue Masters?

The "conspiracy theory" about big multinational record labels pushing the vinyl record prices up to alienate the people and pushing them back to digital streams... I would assume it barely is conspiracy, but simply something that happens as a consequence of their business? When corporation who is there most of all to make money, pay salaries of pretty damn huge staff and infra they have, I am sure they'll do vinyl ONLY, absolutely only because it is means to generate money. To generate money from product that can not be sold in huge mass, only way to do it, is to have high price. For underground label, putting out LP and wholesaling it with 1-5 euro profit or less, may be fine. Big corporation can think that unless this pays all the costs, all the salaries of people involved to make it happen and then generate decent income, it is just not worth to do? Not done out of charity or support or personal interest. Most people can imagine the math of publishing business that has sole intention to generate money.

Same is happening with CD's. As soon as there was news that "CD sales are increasing again", Universal / Sony announced year or couple ago that no mid price CD's anymore. Now all the back catalogue is either full price or "nice price", both being so expensive to buy that if you go to regular record store, CD will be 20 euro, unless bought from some discount campaign. I talked to representative of Sony and they mentioned that all steps of production are so expensive that price needs to reflect that. Small labels can make calculation that manufacturing is 2 euro, so let's sell at X euro. Bigger labels have entirely different way how it goes.

[WCN]

The 2 winning essays, describing the solitary noise experience, are now published in a public post on Patreon. They each won a Harbinger Sound LP, their choice of RJF or TRERIKSRÖSET!

I've also started working on a 2-3 (possibly more!) CD compilation representing the first 2 years of WCN Podcast, pairing new material from artists who have been guests with audio from their interview. Final lineup will be announced on October 18, but it's shaping up to be epic already, as you can imagine if you look at who has been a guest so far. This release will only be available to Patreon supporters, and it will only go into production once the Patreon reaches 300 members. 300 personalized copies for each supporter will be available. You can secure your copy and make sure it goes into production as quickly as possible by signing up and supporting today.

https://www.patreon.com/whitecentipedenoise
https://www.patreon.com/whitecentipedenoise
https://www.patreon.com/whitecentipedenoise

[Skuggsidan]

OUT NOW - Steve Underwood of Harbinger Sound on WCN Podcast !!! https://youtu.be/AVNfx2AzmBI

Steve Underwood is an international legend in underground music. He ran the eclectic UK based label Harbinger Sound, managed numerous bands, and was responsible for some unforgettable live events. He now resides in the town of Hastings, where he runs a record shop called Pressing Matters Records, and continues his involvement in the culture. He joined me at WCN HQ for an in person interview, which we continued on at his hotel during his visit to Cologne.

I think latest Harbinger lathe being re-released is on Skuggsidan's side label Analogue Masters?

This statement is correct. We are currently working on the final details of this re-release. Thus, any other activity from us is rather sparse, as we are working on several upcoming releases. We will probably close down our distribution business in the near future and dedicate ourselves to being just a label on a full scale.

[WCN]

Out now - Andrew Grant of THE VOMIT ARSONIST on WCN Podcast!!!

https://youtu.be/NdNkGNo27gY

Andrew Grant aka THE VOMIT ARSONIST is a Providence based powerhouse of bleak and cinematic death industrial, releasing deeply personal concept based works on labels such as Cloister, Malignant, as well as his own imprint, Danvers State. We had a down to earth discussion about his body of work, major influences, and upcoming activities - including two upcoming shows in California on September 29 and 30th, 2023. You can support Andrew directly through his bandcamp https://thevomitarsonist.bandcamp.com/ or by reaching out to him directly on IG at @thevomitarsonist to buy artist copies of his recent releases.

In the EXT. segment of this episode, we discuss Andrew's use of samples in his work, as well as a memorable show at the Borg Ward in Milwaukee, where DEATH JENK played with THE VOMIT ARSONIST. Andrew also shared a killer unreleased 26+ minute track with the Maniac's Circle.

All that and more at https://www.patreon.com/whitecentipedenoise

[FreakAnimalFinland]

Funnily I was just listening Vomit Arsonist couple days ago, pulling random CD from shelves and deciding to go for it - and liking it probably more than years ago when CD's kept coming out more actively.

Have talked with bunch of people about the kind of lurking downfall of physical noise thing. Somewhat similar discussion is here, being connected to why Danvers State label is on some sort of hiatus. One thing he is saying, is that trading no longer that good thing to do when you spend 10 bucks to ship out the tape. I have no doubts noise keeps going in morphed state. My assumption is, there will be less of self published or small labels that get their stuff into hands of distributors. Both because of it will be too expensive to get into distribution plus that there may be lack of actually existing distributors in first place. it is changes so much. If it is all about direct sale from someone bandcamp or big cartel, I am 10000% sure it simply cuts out large part of noise audience who feel that type of noise is not what they're part of it.
You often hear that "oh, but people still buy beer and...". Yeah, but a lot of people go to bar and see the 10-20 euro import craft beer and wonder what the hell I'm doing here? Is some sort of handjob from waitress included or what is this bullshit? And go grab 2-3 euro beer from store.


We have often discussed with people, what it is that most people have absolute difficult to list even couple new great releases. It ain't lack of new great releases. But is the lack of experience. Not even talking of virgin experience, the big wooowww of first being experiencing something. But I'd personally know as fact, that just listening SCATHING tape on Dada Drumming while typing this, and being blown away by the massive noise... it has a lot to do, with pulling out actual tape from the packaging, having waited the box from USA to arrive, consciously looking at the cover, blasting it via real stereo system.  I can't say this as a fact, but I would make strong hypothesis that the whatever noise one listened recently from bandcamp stream, the reason you don't remember it, and reason it never made strong mark to you, was that it simply didn't mean that much. It was just the same play button in identical lay-out of service, when you heard something you can't next day even remember what it was. All the actual communication, effort, anticipation, physical experience etc.  is absent?

In a way, more interesting questions than top-5 new noise, could be discussion why would it be so hard to mention even couple inspiring new things, unless one would flat out mention having not heard any new stuff that would be simple explanation. Maybe another thing is, that like is discussed in this episode, there seems to be growing caution, especially for legitimate artists, to do any name dropping. Just to not appear as fan boys. I would also assume it may be partially something that it has been analyzed people actually post about cool things they listen, not necessary the actual stuff they do listen. It may be odd side effect of social media, where you get likes and exposure for posting liked and appreciated thing. Rarity and commonly appreciated stuff. It shifts the way at least part of communication.

[Andrew McIntosh]

I can't say this as a fact, but I would make strong hypothesis that the whatever noise one listened recently from bandcamp stream, the reason you don't remember it, and reason it never made strong mark to you, was that it simply didn't mean that much. It was just the same play button in identical lay-out of service, when you heard something you can't next day even remember what it was. All the actual communication, effort, anticipation, physical experience etc.  is absent?

This reminds me of some other arguments I've read for the viability of physical items over digital, like vinyl, that go along the lines of "I like to have something physical in my hands while I'm listening/having to put the record on and flip it over makes me work for the music" and so on. All the emphasis seems to be on this particular experience, and away from the actual music itself. I always thought that was strange. Understandable, to a degree. But ultimately, why is the actual sound just considered just another element of a whole experience, especially when all it is, is getting something to listen to?

A lot of the original innovators of Noise - The Haters, Macronympha, Merzbow, Con-Dom, etc - can all be found on Bandcamp now. For people who have never heard these projects before, just getting into Noise for example, I wonder if their experience with what they hear if it's only on Bandcamp is as you say? It makes no impression, they don't remember it, etc? I wonder if the missing component of actually listening to and liking that material really is the lack of the whole rigamarole of choosing, ordering, waiting, unwrapping, reading, putting onto the stereo and the rest.

Because, if that's so, then a question rises. Was that stuff really all that good in the first place? Stripped of the whole analog physical mystique, does the actual sound really rank all that highly? Or was everyone just bamboozled by having to go through the whole physical ritual of choosing, ordering, etc?

I'm going to make some guesses. I'm going to guess that no, the whole physical ritual did not enhance the listening experience, because it was and is still possible to order and get something you don't particularly care for. Also, because a lot of that innovative stuff was and is just great on its own, whether it's in a limited edition box set or on Bandcamp, or both.

I'm also going to guess that the whole physical ritual was more a time-and-place thing when the innovative stuff happened to happen. We've reached a point now where, I believe, there's not a lot more innovation happening in Noise, and instead there's a lot of duplication of old ideas. Hardly any wonder that anyone just going through Bandcamp may not be so inspired to hear stuff that's been done before, and better. I mean - how many junk metal projects does the world need now? Wall Noise projects? PE projects with grainy, photocopied graphics and ultra pornographic "content"? Just how many times can all these cliches and more be replicated before a listener thinks, look, this is okay and all but I'm going to stick with the originals because I can?

If there's nothing much to say about recent Noise, it's because there's nothing much to say about it. Not because it's just on Bandcamp or anything like that. But I've had to concede that younger ears and minds will have a newer, less experienced reception to Noise, so I wonder if their enjoyment of Noise is also dependent on the physical ritual, particularly in a time when, for the most part, it just isn't necessary?

[DBL]

I don't think there needs to be some either-or situation with liking just the sound or absolutely requiring somehow fancy (be it due to some kind of manual effort or just an expensive/luxurious result) or fitting packaging to accompany the sounds. No need to discuss absolutes, just acknowledging that these things might have some effect, whether one likes it or admits/acknowledges it. Similarly to how having to anticipate and build expectations for hearing something for weeks might make it a whole different approach to checking something out than clicking a link, skipping to the best bits and giving up when you don't find any in a few seconds as you are already being recommended a new thing to check out. Not that this would be some noise/music phenomenon as such, but just a modern online life thing in general. Stuck in a FOMO flow.

As imaginary examples, pixelized graphics or abundant typos (not due to language barrier but due to laziness) and such things that you can see even in bandcamp releases can make it easy to think that if the maker didn't care to put effort to that, does the same attitude apply to the sound as well. Having a negative initial attitude makes it way easier to skip looking into something or just give it less attention than it would deserve otherwise, especially now when there's just a ton of new noise coming out so one is quite likely not running out on things to check out at any moment. On the other hand, if the packaging (or digital graphics) seems somehow captivating, maybe it can lure you to check the sound more easier. But of course I have been "lied to" by neat graphics on a shit sound same as everyone else, so I'm not trying to sugarcoat that aspect of this.

Similar thing could be said about the difference between being recommended some release or artist by someone whose tastes you trust vs. being recommended something by personalized or un-personalized autoplay recommendations. You might like or hate it just the same no matter what way you found it, but it still is a different starting point.

You also have to keep in mind what some people and programs/services will absolutely censor or hide from you even though they know it'd be something you might find interesting. This applies to both graphics and themes. At some point bandcamp banned/deleted bands with unsuitable genre tags (I recall it was goregrind, after some related shooting incident I think?), no idea if they still have something similar going on. YouTube requires registration to see vids with too much swearing, lots of stuff on instagram requires registration to see, and so on. All this has an effect on what and how you come across, or CAN come across, and this will probably eventually have an effect what is being made as the wrong kind of thing might just get you automatically hidden from view. I have my doubts if all works by Con-Dom would be fine and approved to be uploaded to bandcamp for example - and if not, are new listeners getting introduced to the real actual Con-Dom in its entirety, or some tidied/tamed version. Physical media might be a bit more lenient in that sense.

Also there's the discussion of if you're glad with just the sound, or do you hunger for some concepts and ideas that extend beyond the sound that could be enhanced with visual or tactile elements, or would such things rather be a distraction. And again I am not trying to present these two approaches as opposites or somehow different in value or meaning, I am just saying that not all sound might get the same benefit (or take the same damage) from some certain graphical etc. solutions. Same goes for if you like noise, industrial etc. as some solitary treat, or if you see the social connections, discussion etc. as a vital and organic part on your involvement in it all. This could be linked back to the discussion on if one's perception to the heard sound would change if it was in fact made by some artificial intelligence instead of a person, but I think my message is already messy enough without going there too.

And of course some stuff just becomes iconic or easily recognizeable and starts getting positive and negative baggage. For example would Tokyo Anal Dynamite or Pulse Demon be the exact same if they had just blank white covers with the band name and title written in comic sans, or if there was just a pixelized photo of a rubber chicken on them?

So while I agree that any physicality and rituals might not be necessary, it can still be acknowledged that they might have different results. Not mentioning how digital and physical listening might happen on a wholly different quality sound systems or how a cassette dub can be way weaker compared to bandcamp audio, which are matters of laziness/conveniece or just bad luck. "It's a jungle out there."

[FreakAnimalFinland]

I can't say this as a fact, but I would make strong hypothesis that the whatever noise one listened recently from bandcamp stream, the reason you don't remember it, and reason it never made strong mark to you, was that it simply didn't mean that much. It was just the same play button in identical lay-out of service, when you heard something you can't next day even remember what it was. All the actual communication, effort, anticipation, physical experience etc.  is absent?

This reminds me of some other arguments I've read for the viability of physical items over digital, like vinyl, that go along the lines of "I like to have something physical in my hands while I'm listening/having to put the record on and flip it over makes me work for the music" and so on. All the emphasis seems to be on this particular experience, and away from the actual music itself. I always thought that was strange. Understandable, to a degree. But ultimately, why is the actual sound just considered just another element of a whole experience, especially when all it is, is getting something to listen to?

Like DBL says above, I think its not about either-or situation, but there is messy cross-over of many things. But, the physical noise culture, how I personally associate to it, leans towards industrial culture traditions and overall emphasis is not about merely getting something to listen to. The something is often very very very particular. Not something to listen, but something you just did not consume, but was result of either lifestyle, worldview, experience, life long bonds with people who apparently contribute something into your life (regardless are they really friends). I do not know many noiseheads who would be able to deconstruct noise from all what makes it culture, artform or life itself.

Because, if that's so, then a question rises. Was that stuff really all that good in the first place? Stripped of the whole analog physical mystique, does the actual sound really rank all that highly? Or was everyone just bamboozled by having to go through the whole physical ritual of choosing, ordering, etc?

Indeed, to deconstruct noise into to supposedly purest form, just the abrasive sound, and then assume we could evaluate it. Many noisemakers I know, do not only make "sound". The sound is part of something larger, and by deciding one wants nothing to do with the expression and experience, and merely "something to listen to", I do feel it is fine for them, but not for me.

Just like think of contemporary hardcore punk. As a guy, who likes many types of hardcore punk, I could drop top 5 any moment. All old titles. To drop list of top 5 recent days genre releases, would be vastly harder. Things I want from the genre, I do not see common in current genre. I could also instantly tell reasons what and why so. In noise, I could probably name drop top-5 tapes of this month, that I felt are pushing either their own expression further or expanding current expression further or their respective location further. Do they advance entire global noise genre, would remain to be judged later on.

If there's nothing much to say about recent Noise, it's because there's nothing much to say about it. Not because it's just on Bandcamp or anything like that. But I've had to concede that younger ears and minds will have a newer, less experienced reception to Noise, so I wonder if their enjoyment of Noise is also dependent on the physical ritual, particularly in a time when, for the most part, it just isn't necessary?

This would be good question to youngsters. I would however also put some context there, that album being on bandcamp may be different thing that stuff churned into bandcomp by default. Material that wasn't even meant to be anything else may be reason why it ain't so good. I would ask if they interest is pure the sound, or would it be, after all, based on a lot of interviews been listening to - a lot of people have abundance of thoughts over it. Not only sound, but they connect in many other ways. Starting from what the fuck is this to who the hell are these people making this sound, and eventually perhaps I got my 3rd collab tape out with guy from other side of world. And none of it was just something to listen to. It may have started from that, but when couple steps were taken, it no longer was something.

Like we could return into WCN podcast with mr Vomit Arsonist and mr Koufar doing collaboration based on No country for old men. The dude who just wants something to look at, or something to listen to, ain't the guy, who might be on route to turn all their visions based on former writing and expression, into something of their own, perhaps something that deeply effected themselves. I would assume.

Physicality, for me, is not really about "fancy packaging". It is noise as integral part of life, not as virtual experience. That can be said in internet forum, as said in beginning, it is not either-or situation. This forum, as it is, or I'd hope it to be, is the gateway to noise as physical life and even industrial-culture related worldview. It can cross over with play button in cyberspace, but it is absolutely opposite to "something to listen to".

[Andrew McIntosh]

absolutely opposite to "something to listen to".

You seem to be using that phrase in a different context than I was. Noise, or indeed any other musical or sound genre, is, at the end, something to listen to. I don't take that trivially, others might (and that's their privilege).

As far as the use and communication of ideas are concerned, that's all to do with the sound itself as well. At least, I'd hope so. I realise it doesn't always work as intended, but again, that should also be part of the whole process of putting something out for other people to listen to.

DBL is right about it not being an either/or situation, certainly in practice. I do find it odd, though, all the emphasis on the non-audio elements. That's just me, but I don't think I'm the only one (probably in a minority, though). To me, first and foremost, if I'm going to listen to Noise, I am going to listen to Noise. Everything else has become a poor second in my experience. Not that I don't have physical items I'm happy to have, but if the sounds themselves aren't up my ally I may as well throw out the vinyl or tapes or whatever and keep the packaging.

In fact, I think I brought this up before - have/are people just doing pure Noise objects? What I mean is, not stuff like t-shirts or the rest, but actual physical objects that are meant to be part of the whole Noise/Industrial scene/thing/whatever? Objects that aren't meant to be listened to, but...well, looked at, played with, fucked?

[Balor/SS1535]

absolutely opposite to "something to listen to".

In fact, I think I brought this up before - have/are people just doing pure Noise objects? What I mean is, not stuff like t-shirts or the rest, but actual physical objects that are meant to be part of the whole Noise/Industrial scene/thing/whatever? Objects that aren't meant to be listened to, but...well, looked at, played with, fucked?

Maybe some of the anti-records by The New Blockaders and others?  Perhaps also when The Gerogerigegege releases a broken tape or his pulled teeth/dentures at various times?

[Andrew McIntosh]

Maybe some of the anti-records by The New Blockaders and others?  Perhaps also when The Gerogerigegege releases a broken tape or his pulled teeth/dentures at various times?

Ah, yes, anti-records. Quite forgot about them. Ron Lessard used to make them as well, didn't he? That definitely counts.

Didn't know that about Gero's dentures. Sounds appropriate.

[FreakAnimalFinland]

I think it is partly question what is part of expression. As noise expression, I don't think it ever was "just sound".
As example, sometimes when I listen to rock music, I get hear someone saying that "you wouldn't listen that, unless there was such lyrics". Yeah, indeed! Exactly! It is not like rock music as a sound, would be complete. I ain't listening just the dumb repetitions of same chords over and over again, but the actual expression, that includes every detail in it - including lyrics, vocal style, context and authenticity of expression (or illusion of it).

Same way, noise itself, rarely just deconstructed sound of noise. Now, that noise sound can be made with gadget you bought for purpose of noise making, upload it into service meant for audio distribution, and post about it to anonymous mass who is after noise... it may be noise, but it is vastly different kind of noise than the noise where every step of the expression and communication happened in ways it had cross-over or to related expression. I know some can value is noise good, merely based on rejecting everything else than sound. Yes, it can be great. But even that great, can be even greater.

My hypothesis would be that IF the sound itself would be all that matters, we could listen the machine. We could just listen modular synth patch play itself. We could listen hour long HNW crackles with no touch of human hand. Some people do. I don't. And I doubt those materials, how good they are, never make into someones "best of ____" lists. It would appear to display, we usually appreciate the human mind, human interaction behind the art, and after recognizing the need of personality and physicality of maker, conclusion may be that level of physicality and interaction with maker benefits from more concrete involvement.  Not for everybody, sure, but I would put quite big bet on hypothesis that just like your top-5 noise gigs ever, won't be youtube streams, but something you attended to, effect of noise release via physical reality will have more profound effect than "found it from youtube".

Would be curious to see, if the podcast makers could get some questions from the artists and diehard noise heads about this type of matters. We'll see!

[Andrew McIntosh]

I have listened to hours of just pure sound and enjoyed it. Not perhaps in the same way as a "proper" Noise release, but that's the point, there are different ways and reasons to listen to sound. Which is why there wouldn't be a need for, say, ten hours of rain on YT being included in any Top 5 or whatever. I can dig a "carefully crafted" Noise release and ten hours of rain both, for different reasons.