General butthurt & pc faggotry etc

[calaverasgrande]

Yeah, or when pressed on it I guess people might pretend as though there isn't any kind of discussion around these things at all.

But it's such an old and boring discussion. Been going on since Throbbing Gristle. What good comes from going over the same arguments for the umpteenth time?

as many people weren't around for the debates around throbbing gristle et al-too young, not even born etc
also given that the various tropes keep returning through new bands etc, then so will the arguments, after all there is never any conclusion to this type of debate.

I'm old enough to remember Boyd Rice, Throbbing Gristle, Monte Cazzaza etc.
While those artists are well known to have offensive material, and to engage in deliberately confrontational performance tactics. None of them were being jackasses.

I'd also say that most of those early Industrial/Noise acts were not picking sides. They were operating outside of the good/bad dichotomy.  Either an examination of, reducto ad absurdiam, satire etc.
I'd also posit that most of these acts were essentially nihilists. Picking a side and actually being a nazi was just as bad as being a Democrat. However portraying a nazi in order to infuriate Democrats? Beautiful.

I object (artistically) to some of the newer acts which apparently profess nazism or somesuch not because of some SJW bullshit.
But because its a copout, and a classic example of 'looking at the finger when I'm pointing at the moon'.

[david lloyd jones]

Yeah, or when pressed on it I guess people might pretend as though there isn't any kind of discussion around these things at all.

But it's such an old and boring discussion. Been going on since Throbbing Gristle. What good comes from going over the same arguments for the umpteenth time?

as many people weren't around for the debates around throbbing gristle et al-too young, not even born etc
also given that the various tropes keep returning through new bands etc, then so will the arguments, after all there is never any conclusion to this type of debate.

I'm old enough to remember Boyd Rice, Throbbing Gristle, Monte Cazzaza etc.
While those artists are well known to have offensive material, and to engage in deliberately confrontational performance tactics. None of them were being jackasses.

I'd also say that most of those early Industrial/Noise acts were not picking sides. They were operating outside of the good/bad dichotomy.  Either an examination of, reducto ad absurdiam, satire etc.
I'd also posit that most of these acts were essentially nihilists. Picking a side and actually being a nazi was just as bad as being a Democrat. However portraying a nazi in order to infuriate Democrats? Beautiful.

I object (artistically) to some of the newer acts which apparently profess nazism or somesuch not because of some SJW bullshit.
But because its a copout, and a classic example of 'looking at the finger when I'm pointing at the moon'.

in the uk, some did indeed choose sides and positioned themselves as liberal democrat and not nihilist at all.
non commenters were usually right wing-real or fancied. few, if any saw themselves as nihilist.

[Yrjö-Koskinen]

I object (artistically) to some of the newer acts which apparently profess nazism or somesuch not because of some SJW bullshit.
But because its a copout, and a classic example of 'looking at the finger when I'm pointing at the moon'.

I've touched on this in the Black Metal-thread, but I think it is also relevant for other genres. Politics in music can, sometimes, be very effective in an artistic sense, even if you're not very fond of the actual opinions. It has to be done right, though, and it is very difficult to formulate a rule for what is "right". Personally I hate almost all political punk/oi music, for instance, regardless of the exact politics. It almost always has an air of Youth Center rehearsal space shitheads thinking they've figured the world out, while actually just being... Well, Youth Center rehearsal space shitheads. This would go for everything from terrible German RAC to Rage Against the Machine. Don't get me wrong, there is some great german RAC, and the "Bombtrack" video's tribute to the Shining Path is comedy gold, but from a purely aesthetic standpoint (which is becoming more and more important to me as I grow older and more cynical), most political music is garbage.

[Scat-O-Logy]

Gurka

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768563/German-mayor-fire-posting-joke-picture-cucumber-looks-like-burka.html

[calaverasgrande]

I object (artistically) to some of the newer acts which apparently profess nazism or somesuch not because of some SJW bullshit.
But because its a copout, and a classic example of 'looking at the finger when I'm pointing at the moon'.

I've touched on this in the Black Metal-thread, but I think it is also relevant for other genres. Politics in music can, sometimes, be very effective in an artistic sense, even if you're not very fond of the actual opinions. It has to be done right, though, and it is very difficult to formulate a rule for what is "right". Personally I hate almost all political punk/oi music, for instance, regardless of the exact politics. It almost always has an air of Youth Center rehearsal space shitheads thinking they've figured the world out, while actually just being... Well, Youth Center rehearsal space shitheads. This would go for everything from terrible German RAC to Rage Against the Machine. Don't get me wrong, there is some great german RAC, and the "Bombtrack" video's tribute to the Shining Path is comedy gold, but from a purely aesthetic standpoint (which is becoming more and more important to me as I grow older and more cynical), most political music is garbage.

Honestly as much as I love good Black Metal, as soon as any of those musicians starts talking during an interview it is, well how you put it. Pure comedy gold.  But I suppose comin from such a country as Norway their experience of and reaction to social constucts like Christianity are going to be much different than for someone like me that grew up in a much more heterogeneous place like the Deep South of the US.
Still, can't hate on the guitar sounds.

As far as noise, PE, Industrial acts that are liberal democrat or leftist. I suppose Test Dept and SPK did some pro labor type stuff. I think I recall Coil as well had something of that nature in terms of aids activism? Maybe I am confusing them with someone else. I need another coffee.
I still think that there is a difference between artistically motivated political statements, and politically motivated artistic statements.

[bitewerksMTB]

Just don't fucking talk to anyone:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/07/us/campuses-cautiously-train-freshmen-against-subtle-insults.html?smid=tw-share&_r=1

[david lloyd jones]

Just don't fucking talk to anyone:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/07/us/campuses-cautiously-train-freshmen-against-subtle-insults.html?smid=tw-share&_r=1

That article has got to be satire, right? I'm assuming those "microaggression" sample statements are fake and purposefully meant to be ignorant or humorous in their sly provocation - shouldn't they have learned societal abilities (or as I call it "common sense") through school, family, weekend jobs, or being alive for nearly 20 years? It's not hard - you make a mistake or faux pas, you get told that's not correct or proper, you don't do it again. I hate to think that an entire generation is being lumped in with this mollycoddled mentality for the sake of media frenzy, but maybe I'm wrong.

unfortunately, unlikely to be satire, but state os us colleges now and UK colleges soon if madness spreads

[calaverasgrande]

there was a pretty good magazine cover last week about that whole microagression thing.
Picture of a young woman (blonde, white) with her fists clasped to her ears and an angry look on her face.
In a crib.

I grew up in a highly racist part of the US. I used to get beat up for having 'nigger' friends.
That is what racism tastes like to me.  This whole stupid thing about being a racist because your use of blah blah blah term implies blah blah blah. It's a bunch of middle class kids that are newly exposed to the concepts of race, class and gender and they are intent on being radical change agents. Except that things are actually pretty damn fair these days. So they have to make up imaginary problems.

[Andrew McIntosh]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/10/as-lionel-shriver-made-light-of-identity-i-had-no-choice-but-to-walk-out-on-her#comments

[calaverasgrande]

"I can't speak for the LGBTQI community, those who are neuro-different or people with disabilities, but that's also the point. I don't speak for them, and should allow for their voices and experiences to be heard and legitimised."

I when you said gay ebcause 'queer' was bad. Then in the 80's or 90's queer became the n word that gay people used to refer to each other. So it confuses me to see LGB and also Q? I assume the T is trans, but what on earth is I?
Interested?
Then the really good part, "neuro-different".
What. The. Fuck.
Is that for mentally ill people? Or mentally disabled?
Are ADHD/Dyslexic qualified as neuro-different?
I'm a certified, diagnosed ADHD/Dyslexic. Had the good speed prescribed for years for it.
Maybe I'm neuro-different too! Does that make me gay? Better learn to suck cock I guess.

[cantle]

LesbianGayBisexualTranssexualQuestioningIntersex

Nuerodifferent is the autistic spectrum

[Andrew McIntosh]

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2016/sep/12/teenagers-healthy-eating-rebellious

When I eat healthy, I am helping to make the world a better place.

[Theodore]

When I eat healthy, I am helping to make the world a better place.

[Scat-O-Logy]

Quality journalism from a very triggered person.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christian-gabriel/if-you-dont-vote-democrat_b_10425968.html

[calaverasgrande]

LesbianGayBisexualTranssexualQuestioningIntersex

Nuerodifferent is the autistic spectrum

I totally forgot about that whole fashionably autistic thing. I even did a project with a young woman who was 'on the spectrum'. Funny she had zero problems relating to people in a social context, holding down a job or generally functioning.
Thank god that project never reached fruition. She was such a whiny hypochondriac trust fundy.